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Generation 4-2 Pajero NT model 2009 - 2011

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  #1  
Old 07-06-17
Luke68 Luke68 is offline
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Default Transfer case gears

Hi, just purchased a NT VRX with everything including sunroof. But am a little disappointed with the low range gearing. Coming from discovery 1 manual that was great to the Pajero is a letdown. Have been reading about marks 4wd gears but cant find anything for the NT.
Has anyone looked into if the Paj Sport transfer would fit the Nt/Nw/Nx with the larger auto?

Cheers
Luke
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  #2  
Old 07-06-17
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Rnn_onmt Rnn_onmt is offline
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Portal axle hubs. There's your answer! 😉

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Old 07-06-17
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Yes, they are (were?) available. I checked the website, but couldn't find the listing.

I have a set in my NT, and at the time, they said they made 5 sets - I suggest giving them a call.

The set are 3.15:1, with 19 splines on the input gear, to suit the Aisin gearbox. If you don't get anywhere on the phone, post up again and I'll see if I can find a name to talk to.
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  #4  
Old 07-06-17
Ent Ent is offline
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There is a bit of history with Marks and the designer that means you might wind up going around in circle. Basically Marks do a great product but do not know what version of the gears go with what model. The designer knows that info. I with my Challenger went around in circles with Marks as they wanted me rip out the transfer case, measure and photograph the gears, and then they might get the correct set. Part of the reason is Mitsubishi can run different transfer cases and only detailed knowledge of the VIN lookup will tell you what is required was the story I got.

Anyway try Wholesale Automatic Transmissions in Melbourne, they did mine. I would love to say they are great to deal with and do good work but I got my vehicle back with all the transfer bolts loose as the final torquing up sequence was missed. I now have a slight oil leak from the rear of the case despite having that seal replaced. Hope nothing was damage in the time from pickup to when it was noticed, maybe fifty kilometres later. They however do know their stuff so maybe I struck a hung over apprentice that day.

The gear comes in 2.7, 2.85 and 3.15 versions with automatic being different to manual versions. The 3.15 needs more grinding of the transfer case and selector rod to fit in. For serious rock climbing the 3.15 is the go, but the 2.7 is probably a better around choice. Wholesale Automatic Transmission have a Triton with the 3.15 and believe it is just too low outside rock work. I have the 2.7 as that is the only one they could get as it is a safer option requiring less grinding of the transfer case and selector. The 3.15 is occasionally made in batches of 10 so I am told but Marks want prepayment for all ten. The others are made as stock item. Big export business for Marks as in high demand in the USSR and Africa.

The 2.7 in my Challenger gives about the same low low ratio as a Nissan Patrol and for my manual thus works a treat. It enables you to idle up most climbs at walking pace but still in low fifth gives 86 kph top speed, so can working in sand. That is bouncing off the rev limiter so 60 kph more practical top speed. What I found was I got a proper low gear with other gears being a little shorter than the original but one gear higher.

In high range you have no change in gearbox noise but in low it is a bit noisier. You might find in the manual gear a fraction harder to shift.

But in my opinion it is the best modification that you can do to a Mitsubishi to improve off-road performance. So good that finally Mitsubishi have done a lower transfer gear that with the eight speed auto gives much the same gearing as Marks gives you.
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  #5  
Old 07-06-17
pajeromack pajeromack is offline
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Yeah the low range ratio is a pain. Even worse when you've got a manual transmission. Mitsubishi's older vehicles all run a 1.9 ratio which isn't quite adequate. Especially given the lack of low down torque.

I doubt a Pajero sport transfer case would fit. Fortunately there are aftermarket transfer gears available. If you do go down this path bear in mind that you are increasing torque loads through the CV's and diffs.
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Old 07-06-17
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Ian Sharpe Ian Sharpe is offline
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Quote:
Originally Posted by Ent View Post
There is a bit of history with Marks and the designer that means you might wind up going around in circle. Basically Marks do a great product but do not know what version of the gears go with what model. The designer knows that info. I with my Challenger went around in circles with Marks as they wanted me rip out the transfer case, measure and photograph the gears, and then they might get the correct set. Part of the reason is Mitsubishi can run different transfer cases and only detailed knowledge of the VIN lookup will tell you what is required was the story I got.

Anyway try Wholesale Automatic Transmissions in Melbourne, they did mine. I would love to say they are great to deal with and do good work but I got my vehicle back with all the transfer bolts loose as the final torquing up sequence was missed. I now have a slight oil leak from the rear of the case despite having that seal replaced. Hope nothing was damage in the time from pickup to when it was noticed, maybe fifty kilometres later. They however do know their stuff so maybe I struck a hung over apprentice that day.

The gear comes in 2.7, 2.85 and 3.15 versions with automatic being different to manual versions. The 3.15 needs more grinding of the transfer case and selector rod to fit in. For serious rock climbing the 3.15 is the go, but the 2.7 is probably a better around choice. Wholesale Automatic Transmission have a Triton with the 3.15 and believe it is just too low outside rock work. I have the 2.7 as that is the only one they could get as it is a safer option requiring less grinding of the transfer case and selector. The 3.15 is occasionally made in batches of 10 so I am told but Marks want prepayment for all ten. The others are made as stock item. Big export business for Marks as in high demand in the USSR and Africa.

The 2.7 in my Challenger gives about the same low low ratio as a Nissan Patrol and for my manual thus works a treat. It enables you to idle up most climbs at walking pace but still in low fifth gives 86 kph top speed, so can working in sand. That is bouncing off the rev limiter so 60 kph more practical top speed. What I found was I got a proper low gear with other gears being a little shorter than the original but one gear higher.

In high range you have no change in gearbox noise but in low it is a bit noisier. You might find in the manual gear a fraction harder to shift.

But in my opinion it is the best modification that you can do to a Mitsubishi to improve off-road performance. So good that finally Mitsubishi have done a lower transfer gear that with the eight speed auto gives much the same gearing as Marks gives you.
AFAIK Mark Hardman of Hardman Bros in Melb (the original designer of the Pajeros gears) bought out & now owns Marks 4x4. Unless it has changed hands again (or Mark or Leigh have retired) , I cant see there being a problem with not knowing what fits where. Frank Zanetti & I sent Mark Hardman a Gen 2, 3.0l transfer case to start the R&D for Gen 2. That was way back in the early 2000;s. After that Mark made some gears for the bigger 3.5l transfer cases that were originally 3.15 (since reduced to 2.70). I believe my case was the first in Au to be fitted. After that came the gears for the Gen 3. That was kick started by another member on here who sent Hardmans his Gen 3 case. When NJ done his transfer case & wanted to rebuild with lower gears , a kit was developed for the NT Pajeros that ran the Asian transmission (diesel vehicles) as those vehiciles have a different input shaft to the transfer case to the petrols. (see chart). The counter gear & low range gears are the same across Gen 3/4. One could assume that the gears for the NT diesel would fit the NW but the only way to check would be to cross match original part numbers. (if someone wants to send me their NW vin, I can update the chart).

As far as Wholesale Automatics providing gears, I would suggest that they only sourced them from Marks as I doubt they would have the gear making equipment to do it themselves and AFAIK Hardman was the only supplier on a global basis. Glad to be proved wrong though if anyone has evidence to the contrary.
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Last edited by Ian Sharpe; 07-06-17 at 05:06 PM.
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  #7  
Old 07-06-17
Ent Ent is offline
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You are correct the gears come from Marks as they they specialise in gear cutting and by all accounts very good at it.

The reason for Wholesale Automatics is they actually know what gear goes in what transfer case and model, plus also how to remove and modify the transfer case plus the special tools to do the job. Plenty of people buy direct from Marks and successfully fitted the lower gear, but according to Marks themselves a lot of people strike problems. Using Wholesale Automatics to do the job is a case of buying knowledge.

I am sure if you understood the Mitsubishi part number system and the different transfer cases you could get the right gears and install it yourself. Trouble was Marks had no idea what gears fitted my Challenger.

On the Triton website there is a very long discussion on the gears and their history. Apart from someone breaking apart a transfer case (I think he acknowledge he was been a bit of hero at the time) they appears to have no other problems. There was an attempt to get a different gear cutter and also supply another selector arm as on some sets a significant amount of metal needs to be removed from the selector. There is a installation manual kicking around the web but I think it is for an earlier model Pajero.

Marks might be able to help but it took many attempts to contact them and then they wanted pictures and teeth count, etc to identify the gear needed. Wholesale Automatics just needed the model number and if it was a manual or auto.

As said the 3.15 sets are extremely rare and probably not ideal for most 4x4 driving, but they do give almost rock crawler level of reduction. I was actually after them, or the 2.85 version, but as said only the 2.7 was available. Still very happy with that ratio in a manual. Probably be even better in an auto. From memory the standard low low is 29.4, 2.7 with factory tyres 45, and the 3.15 somewhat under 50:1. Because you have to stop to select low range the 3.15 might be a bit annoying while the 2.7 has enough head room on top speed to cover the faster stages of a track.

Anyway, happy hunting. Mine have done 40,000 plus kilometres ok part from rear transfer case seal slightly weeping.
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  #8  
Old 07-06-17
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Ian Sharpe Ian Sharpe is offline
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Quote:
Originally Posted by Ent View Post
You are correct the gears come from Marks as they they specialise in gear cutting and by all accounts very good at it.

The reason for Wholesale Automatics is they actually know what gear goes in what transfer case and model, plus also how to remove and modify the transfer case plus the special tools to do the job. Plenty of people buy direct from Marks and successfully fitted the lower gear, but according to Marks themselves a lot of people strike problems. Using Wholesale Automatics to do the job is a case of buying knowledge.

I am sure if you understood the Mitsubishi part number system and the different transfer cases you could get the right gears and install it yourself. Trouble was Marks had no idea what gears fitted my Challenger.

On the Triton website there is a very long discussion on the gears and their history. Apart from someone breaking apart a transfer case (I think he acknowledge he was been a bit of hero at the time) they appears to have no other problems. There was an attempt to get a different gear cutter and also supply another selector arm as on some sets a significant amount of metal needs to be removed from the selector. There is a installation manual kicking around the web but I think it is for an earlier model Pajero.

Marks might be able to help but it took many attempts to contact them and then they wanted pictures and teeth count, etc to identify the gear needed. Wholesale Automatics just needed the model number and if it was a manual or auto.

As said the 3.15 sets are extremely rare and probably not ideal for most 4x4 driving, but they do give almost rock crawler level of reduction. I was actually after them, or the 2.85 version, but as said only the 2.7 was available. Still very happy with that ratio in a manual. Probably be even better in an auto. From memory the standard low low is 29.4, 2.7 with factory tyres 45, and the 3.15 somewhat under 50:1. Because you have to stop to select low range the 3.15 might be a bit annoying while the 2.7 has enough head room on top speed to cover the faster stages of a track.

Anyway, happy hunting. Mine have done 40,000 plus kilometres ok part from rear transfer case seal slightly weeping.

Perhaps Marks are thrown off with people wanting Challenger gears & not knowing that they might be the same as Pajero gears? At any rate if I were contacting them I would only speak to Mark or Leigh (if they are still there as they have been in the loop since day 1) . Yes I agree that the 2.70 is perhaps a better ratio for most 4wding. I found 3.15 (in my NL) either 2 low or too high sometimes. WHen I had the 3.15 gears in my NP they were as you say 50:1 which is seriously low. I still have my NL case with 3.15 gears sitting in the shed debating whether to sell it or not.

cheers
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Old 07-06-17
Ent Ent is offline
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Quote:
Originally Posted by Ian Sharpe View Post
Perhaps Marks are thrown off with people wanting Challenger gears & not knowing that they might be the same as Pajero gears? At any rate if I were contacting them I would only speak to Mark or Leigh (if they are still there as they have been in the loop since day 1) . Yes I agree that the 2.70 is perhaps a better ratio for most 4wding. I found 3.15 (in my NL) either 2 low or too high sometimes. WHen I had the 3.15 gears in my NP they were as you say 50:1 which is seriously low. I still have my NL case with 3.15 gears sitting in the shed debating whether to sell it or not.

cheers
Yes I think the issue is they are not familiar with the Triton/Challenger. Mitsubishi is prone to reuse lot of stuff between models and subtle changes between countries. I have experienced buying spare parts through Mitsubishi and they go in by VIN rather than generic model number. Someone connected to Mitsubishi part system can trace components between models. I think even the current PS Sport uses the same rear coil springs that came out with the PA and that stole them from the last of the old chassis Pajeros.

Marks site has the figment guide for a the 2.85 and 3.15. Quick read suggests lot more fitting work required for the 3.15.

Another option is lower diff size. I came across a 4x4 article where they write for the price of a decent bullbar you can do the diffs to any ratio you want though a specialised diff place. Good write up on what taller tyres can do to Automatics with strong suggestion changing diffs is not a bad idea.

We are a funny mob. On something's we open our wallets wide and then penny pinch elsewhere. We chase "standard" figment when often in Australia a specialised manufacturer can produce a better quality product at much the same price. Marks or more accurately Hardmans come up with a lot of improvements so let's support local manufacturers. For Triton/Challenger owners we should get Drummond Motor Sport front suspension as not stupidly expensive once you take into account its longevity and adjustability.

Of course if money is tight then Gumtree can help along with careful analysis what you really need versus what you want.
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Old 07-06-17
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Ian Sharpe Ian Sharpe is offline
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Another option is lower diff size. I came across a 4x4 article where they write for the price of a decent bullbar you can do the diffs to any ratio you want though a specialised diff place. Good write up on what taller tyres can do to Automatics with strong suggestion changing diffs is not a bad idea.
re diff ratios.
Some time ago I crossmatched part numbers & came to the conclusion that crownwheel & pinions sets were compatible across Gen 2 (3.5l & TDi) Gen 3 & probably Gen 4, however you would need to swap flanges. So that meant that you could fit the Gen 2, 4.636 & 4.90 into the Gen 3 or fit the 4.3 or 4.1 etc into Gen 2. Quite a good range.
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