2019 Siberia and Central Asia overland thread

[benckj]

Can easily understand the roads and 2wd capability. It wasn’t that long ago 4WD was reserved for only a few vehicles for people with deep pockets. Now every other car is 4WD although not intended for off Roading. Imagine the terrain would be very challenging if you were not in dry summer conditions.

Keep up the progress reports as I also follow your trip through Blog. Even have my wife and son in ChCh reading it. Gives us a sense that we are also along for the journey even if it’s from the comfort our couch.

[kiwi1973]

I've put a new video online (Gobi Desert - Part 2) and there's a new blog on my website.

https://youtu.be/An4C1_TF5XA

https://www.5gooverland.com

[Dmitriy]

Great video [emoji106] some time also will have a journey to Mongolia )


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[kiwi1973]

I had to buy a new set of tyres in Kazakhstan after one of the STT Pro's suffered a catastrophic failure - the bead on one tyre suddenly collapsed and ripped all the way around. I was on road at the time - could have caused an accident potentially, but I reacted quickly.

Coopers aren't available here - not that I can find. They were available in Mongolia, but not here. I identified that Nitto Trail Grappler MT and Toyo Open Country MT are actually basically the same tyre, or very closely related. Sister companies, and it wouldn't surprise me if they're built on the same carcass with different tread patterns. Both get outstanding reviews from users, so I'll be keen to see how they go. Reputed to be quiet and long lasting, in addition to excellent performers. I was tempted to go with the Toyo, as I thought they might look marginally better, but the Nitto was what was available here, and even then I got the only set in town! The beautiful city of Almaty is deep within vast, landlocked Kazakhstan, so I gather it would be a long wait to order anything in.

Next up we're driving from Kazakhstan to Kyrgyzstan. We're heading out into a desert, then via a canyon and finally via mountain lakes amidst forest around 2,000 metres elevation. There's a lot more to Kazakhstan than most people in NZ/Aust (and elsewhere) would think when they think of Kazakhstan. Actually, I think many people have no idea what to picture of Kazakhstan.

I nearly forgot to say, the new tyres cost equivalent to just NZ$1,028 - fitted and balanced. In NZ you'd struggle to buy a really bad set of Chinese tyres for that price. Cooper STT Pro and ST Maxx are near $600 each now, so $2,400 a set! Probably a bit better in Aust. NZ likes to pretend it's high prices are because its so remote compared to the rest of the world. But even in Ulaanbaater, deep in Mongolia , Cooper STT Pro and ST Maxx were selling for just over NZ$300 each in 265/7017 sizing.

[benckj]

Was wondering how you were going. Glad your making progress with only minor hick-ups to contend with.

[kiwi1973]

I've just put a new blog post up on my website. We'll be embarking on some really epic parts of our journey through Central Asia in the coming weeks, as we're now on the doorstep of the 7,500 metre high Pamir mountains.

https://www.5gooverland.com/our-blog

[aussieintas]

Another great read bud on the bliog. Glad you got tyres sorted easily.

[kiwi1973]

I just posted some interesting photos from Kazakhstan in the relevant section on the forum, here:

https://www2.pajeroclub.com.au/forum/showthread.php?t=65212

[kiwi1973]

Kazakhstan and Kyrgyzstan videos

A couple of short videos from Central Asia have just been posted here:

https://www2.pajeroclub.com.au/forum/showthread.php?t=65304

[Jasonmc73]

I had to buy a new set of tyres in Kazakhstan after one of the STT Pro's suffered a catastrophic failure - the bead on one tyre suddenly collapsed and ripped all the way around. I was on road at the time - could have caused an accident potentially, but I reacted quickly.

Coopers aren't available here - not that I can find. They were available in Mongolia, but not here. I identified that Nitto Trail Grappler MT and Toyo Open Country MT are actually basically the same tyre, or very closely related. Sister companies, and it wouldn't surprise me if they're built on the same carcass with different tread patterns. Both get outstanding reviews from users, so I'll be keen to see how they go. Reputed to be quiet and long lasting, in addition to excellent performers. I was tempted to go with the Toyo, as I thought they might look marginally better, but the Nitto was what was available here, and even then I got the only set in town! The beautiful city of Almaty is deep within vast, landlocked Kazakhstan, so I gather it would be a long wait to order anything in.

Next up we're driving from Kazakhstan to Kyrgyzstan. We're heading out into a desert, then via a canyon and finally via mountain lakes amidst forest around 2,000 metres elevation. There's a lot more to Kazakhstan than most people in NZ/Aust (and elsewhere) would think when they think of Kazakhstan. Actually, I think many people have no idea what to picture of Kazakhstan.

I nearly forgot to say, the new tyres cost equivalent to just NZ$1,028 - fitted and balanced. In NZ you'd struggle to buy a really bad set of Chinese tyres for that price. Cooper STT Pro and ST Maxx are near $600 each now, so $2,400 a set! Probably a bit better in Aust. NZ likes to pretend it's high prices are because its so remote compared to the rest of the world. But even in Ulaanbaater, deep in Mongolia , Cooper STT Pro and ST Maxx were selling for just over NZ$300 each in 265/7017 sizing.

Hi Kiwi1973
How are you finding the Nitto tyres overall at this stage?
They appear to have quite A range of useable size LT tyres in "Ridge Grappler" 10 ply/ 2 ply walls
And in comparison to the Coopers that failed out of interest?
What was the history of the Coopers , age etc?

[old Jack]

Hi Kiwi1973
How are you finding the Nitto tyres overall at this stage?
They appear to have quite A range of useable size LT tyres in "Ridge Grappler" 10 ply/ 2 ply walls
And in comparison to the Coopers that failed out of interest?
What was the history of the Coopers , age etc?

Hi Jason,
The Nitto Ridge Grappler is a new comer to the hybrid AT/MT tyre sector, it has only a 13mm tread depth and there are tie bars to minimise tread squirm. 2 ply sidewalls also are a downgrade. They will be cheaper than a Cooper ST Maxx but the ST Maxx have 14.7 mm tread depth, 3ply side walls at offset angles and no tread block tie bars. Mickey Thompson ATZ P3 is similar but the stone ejectors are better on the ST Maxx. The ST Maxx will also have better on road wet weather handling but off road the P3 will have a slight edge. Kumho MT51 is almost identical to the Micckey Thompson ATZ P3 but the tread compound on the P3 is more durable than the cheaper Kuhmo MT51.
Earlier this year I looked at all alternatives to the ST Maxc and there was nothing that tick to same amount or more boxes so I went ST Maxx again for a 3rd consecutive time.

OJ.

[Jasonmc73]

Hi Jason,
The Nitto Ridge Grappler is a new comer to the hybrid AT/MT tyre sector, it has only a 13mm tread depth and there are tie bars to minimise tread squirm. 2 ply sidewalls also are a downgrade. They will be cheaper than a Cooper ST Maxx but the ST Maxx have 14.7 mm tread depth, 3ply side walls at offset angles and no tread block tie bars. Mickey Thompson ATZ P3 is similar but the stone ejectors are better on the ST Maxx. The ST Maxx will also have better on road wet weather handling but off road the P3 will have a slight edge. Kumho MT51 is almost identical to the Micckey Thompson ATZ P3 but the tread compound on the P3 is more durable than the cheaper Kuhmo MT51.
Earlier this year I looked at all alternatives to the ST Maxc and there was nothing that tick to same amount or more boxes so I went ST Maxx again for a 3rd consecutive time.

OJ.

Appreciate the reply Old Jack,
So you don't think one should read to much into how often Coopers seem to appear reported with what seems to be unprovked sidewall probelms?
Could happen to any tyre I guess, puncture/ slow leak higher speeds undetected, that'll be the outcome.
But living near Fraser Island etc disturbs me as LT tyres do need to run low air on beaches which flexes sidewalls more than rocks, bush tracks or corrugations at 25PSI obviously, which will be another intended use.
I see the name Coopers and sidewalls mentioned A bit, also see A lot of people swear by them. 3 ply sidewall is great & makes total sense as long as it holds together low pressure & bags out in soft sand, which is whats on my mind.

[old Jack]

Hi Jsson,

I have been 4wd remote touring for 38 years in a range of vehicles. Land cruiser 55 & 60 series, Subaru, Jackaroo and Challenger, shod with cross plies, retreads, floatation radials, rally tyre's and Light truck AT tyre's, from Olympic, Dunlop, Yokohama, Uniroyal, Michelin, Pirelli, Bridgestone, BF Goodrich and Cooper. A vehicles were all loaded to GVM+ and driven at the upper end of the speed range that conditions permitted.

I have had plenty of tyre punctures and failures, most of which can be traced back to incorrect tyre pressures and or poor suspension setups or the wrong tyre for the loads carried and the terrain traversed. I learned the hard and expensive way, I used to believe in high tyre pressures and super heavy duty stiff suspension. Now days I known it is about getting the combination of the correct suspension that articulates whilst carrying the weight and low tyre pressures.

My tyre problems stopped/reduced when I was running rally suspension and Yokohama rally tyre's on the Subaru. On the Jackaroo upgrade "soft but controlled" suspension and light truck tyre's at low pressures (BFG AT and Cooper ST, 2 sets of each). Both vehicles had over 300,000kms on the odometer when sold. The Challenger has done just over 150,000kms and got its 3rd set of ST Maxx at 142,000kms. I change tyre's when the tread depth is between 3mm and 5mm depending on trips. I have had 2 failures in the Cooper both were when the tyre were at the end of their life and had deep cuts in the sidewalls (that would have rendered most other tyre's as scrap)and the tyre's should have been replaced. Repeated excess sidewall flexing finally resulted in the weakened sidewalls developing an undetected air leak and ultimately tyre failure.

No tyre is bullet proof but Cooper ST Maxx is one of the toughest tyre's I have used and is my current tyre of choice and recommendation for heavy duty recreational 4wd touring. They must be rotated ever 7,500kms to even the wear up and to keep the noise down. It has reasonably good on road manners in dry and wet conditions, and once off the bitumen the tyre really shines in sand, gravel and rocks and is better than most AT's in mud. This time round I also fitted a TPMS in the hope of getting an early warning of air loss before the tyre destroys itself, I have been lucky not to have ruined a rim.

On the super soft sand on our south coast beaches with the sharp limestone rocky headlands, I run 12-14 Psi and down to 8-10psi for short periods if I need to. Of the others I travel with or see in my travels I have way less problems than most others.

OJ.

[Jasonmc73]

Hi Jsson,

I have been 4wd remote touring for 38 years in a range of vehicles. Land cruiser 55 & 60 series, Subaru, Jackaroo and Challenger, shod with cross plies, retreads, floatation radials, rally tyre's and Light truck AT tyre's, from Olympic, Dunlop, Yokohama, Uniroyal, Michelin, Pirelli, Bridgestone, BF Goodrich and Cooper. A vehicles were all loaded to GVM+ and driven at the upper end of the speed range that conditions permitted.

I have had plenty of tyre punctures and failures, most of which can be traced back to incorrect tyre pressures and or poor suspension setups or the wrong tyre for the loads carried and the terrain traversed. I learned the hard and expensive way, I used to believe in high tyre pressures and super heavy duty stiff suspension. Now days I known it is about getting the combination of the correct suspension that articulates whilst carrying the weight and low tyre pressures.

My tyre problems stopped/reduced when I was running rally suspension and Yokohama rally tyre's on the Subaru. On the Jackaroo upgrade "soft but controlled" suspension and light truck tyre's at low pressures (BFG AT and Cooper ST, 2 sets of each). Both vehicles had over 300,000kms on the odometer when sold. The Challenger has done just over 150,000kms and got its 3rd set of ST Maxx at 142,000kms. I change tyre's when the tread depth is between 3mm and 5mm depending on trips. I have had 2 failures in the Cooper both were when the tyre were at the end of their life and had deep cuts in the sidewalls (that would have rendered most other tyre's as scrap)and the tyre's should have been replaced. Repeated excess sidewall flexing finally resulted in the weakened sidewalls developing an undetected air leak and ultimately tyre failure.

No tyre is bullet proof but Cooper ST Maxx is one of the toughest tyre's I have used and is my current tyre of choice and recommendation for heavy duty recreational 4wd touring. They must be rotated ever 7,500kms to even the wear up and to keep the noise down. It has reasonably good on road manners in dry and wet conditions, and once off the bitumen the tyre really shines in sand, gravel and rocks and is better than most AT's in mud. This time round I also fitted a TPMS in the hope of getting an early warning of air loss before the tyre destroys itself, I have been lucky not to have ruined a rim.

On the super soft sand on our south coast beaches with the sharp limestone rocky headlands, I run 12-14 Psi and down to 8-10psi for short periods if I need to. Of the others I travel with or see in my travels I have way less problems than most others.

OJ.

Hi OJ

Thanks for the info, invaluable on carcass at low pressure 8 to 14 PSI, appreciated .
I also like the tip to work out A tyres worth in $$'s by the mm of tread purchased, apart from strength, i've seen you elude to somewhere.
Another logical, but idea i've never thought of

I'm trying to learn the easy way, not the hard expesnive way

Recently got stung by A tyre shop, purchased tyres for camper trailer as they were 8 year old & they showed it as well. So new tyres purchased are almost 3 year old lol, I never give it A thought until month or so after, had A thought to look, Won't get me again, be 1st thing I check.

[kiwi1973]

Hi Kiwi1973
How are you finding the Nitto tyres overall at this stage?
They appear to have quite A range of useable size LT tyres in "Ridge Grappler" 10 ply/ 2 ply walls
And in comparison to the Coopers that failed out of interest?
What was the history of the Coopers , age etc?

Only just saw this. I can't speak for the Ridge Grappler at all, but the Trail Grappler I have are excellent so far and I would buy again. Off-road, on road and wet roads. All excellent. Low noise too. So far wearing very well too.

The Cooper's that failed we're about two years old.