Auto- Mate for PB/PC Challenger.

[m_and_m]

auto-mate progress update

Auto-mate progress update

Last weekend OJ and I spent half the day and evening testing and fine tuning auto-mate gear shift points. Gear changes are now much smoother.

We also took the opportunity to conduct towing tests. auto-mate performed very well, and we confirmed the gear shift profile works equally well regardless of having a tow load or not.

We also did a test up the South East freeway in Adelaide with a heavy trailer. This is a 7km steep and steady climb.

Great results! I've attached the test report. The same results can be expected with lockup-mate and auto-mate.

The remaining work to complete auto-mate is:
1. low-range 4WD performance testing
2. Switching between SPORT and DRIVE modes when using paddle shift or selecting SPORT on the shift lever. When in SPORT mode it operates the same as lockup-mate.
3. Finalise for production - installation manuals etc.

Yes - it's taking a bit longer than we'd hoped but good progress is being made.

The plan is to sell 5 or so units as a beta release to solicit feedback and confirm consistent operation in a variety of cars followed a bit later by the full release.
Let me know if you're interest in the beta release program. I'm after a variety of vehicle setups, from stock to modified. Prefer Adelaide based, but not essential.

[Gusey]

Hi m_and_m, really glad to see the progress you and OJ have made with your products, I am looking forward to finally fitting your Automate and improving the gearbox performance.

I would be happy to participate in the beta testing but may be a little far away, I reside in Townsville.

I can offer a vehicle that has a Roo Systems touring and towing remap, lift kit with 265 x 75 R16 A/T's, other than that the only added weight includes Smart Bart, Rhino Rack ,tow bar, fridge and recovery gear. (it's all below.)

All good if I am am not selected, still will be lining up for the release to purchase the kit.

[old Jack]

I have had another week of daily commuting and a country trip this last weekend to assess the changes Marshall made to Auto-Mate the weekend before when we did some more tuning and tow testing with a 1900kg trailer. In regards to the tow tests Auto-Mate performs just as well up long steep hills as Lockup Mate and almost as good on long descents but Lockup Mate is still a little better as you can selected a lower locked gear for more engine braking. Both are so far in front of the factory program it is like driving a different car!

So now the Challenger is back with Marshall for the fitting of the first production Auto-Mate rather than the test unit, plus also some more fine tuning to the on road program. I should get it back in a few weeks so I can continue testing and can compare results and feedback with those that are going to be involved in the beta testing phase of the pre-release production units.

OJ.

[Dicko1]

I have had another week of daily commuting and a country trip this last weekend to assess the changes Marshall made to Auto-Mate the weekend before when we did some more tuning and tow testing with a 1900kg trailer. In regards to the tow tests Auto-Mate performs just as well up long steep hills as Lockup Mate and almost as good on long descents but Lockup Mate is still a little better as you can selected a lower locked gear for more engine braking. Both are so far in front of the factory program it is like driving a different car!

So now the Challenger is back with Marshall for the fitting of the first production Auto-Mate rather than the test unit, plus also some more fine tuning to the on road program. I should get it back in a few weeks so I can continue testing and can compare results and feedback with those that are going to be involved in the beta testing phase of the pre-release production units.

OJ.

Spending way too much time sorting out this unit for the Challenger! Marshall needs to take time off work and concentrate solely on the upgrade for the Pajero so 2nd gear is all good!.




Only joking.....Those with the Challenger would be silly not to do this mod as soon as it is released. The Pajero which has not got the programming nuances of the Challenger, is so much more better with the addition of the kit. My mate just couldnt believe the difference once he installed it into his NS Pajero. After the EGR block and 2nd filter this would be the mod to put on your "definitely install" list. Well done you mob for getting involved and making this happen.

[old Jack]

Spending way too much time sorting out this unit for the Challenger! Marshall needs to take time off work and concentrate solely on the upgrade for the Pajero so 2nd gear is all good!.




Only joking.....Those with the Challenger would be silly not to do this mod as soon as it is released.

You are not that far off the mark Dicko!
Problem is the Master Programming Module has been fitted to my car so Marshall has not been unable to test a few ideas he has about solving the Gen 4, 2nd gear issue.
So installing a pre production Auto Mate module in my Challenger will free up the Master Programming Module for testing solutions, also what we have learned from trying to solve the Challenger issues is knowledge that could help solve the 2nd gear issue.

OJ.

[pb4x2]

I have had another week of daily commuting and a country trip this last weekend to assess the changes Marshall made to Auto-Mate the weekend before when we did some more tuning and tow testing with a 1900kg trailer. In regards to the tow tests Auto-Mate performs just as well up long steep hills as Lockup Mate and almost as good on long descents but Lockup Mate is still a little better as you can selected a lower locked gear for more engine braking. Both are so far in front of the factory program it is like driving a different car!

So now the Challenger is back with Marshall for the fitting of the first production Auto-Mate rather than the test unit, plus also some more fine tuning to the on road program. I should get it back in a few weeks so I can continue testing and can compare results and feedback with those that are going to be involved in the beta testing phase of the pre-release production units.

OJ.

Hi OJ,
Thanks again for the update the excitement here is beginning to build.
Darryl.

[coughy]

OJ can u take a short video of the auto lock up mate in action ?? pls and the on and off light and switch if any and how it works up and down the gears hill no hill if you get the drift of what i mean pls

[old Jack]

OJ can u take a short video of the auto lock up mate in action ?? pls and the on and off light and switch if any and how it works up and down the gears hill no hill if you get the drift of what i mean pls

Hi Coughy,

I do not get the Challenger back from MM4x4 until next Saturday afternoon, after it has had the latest round of programing changes. Sunday I have a 250km drive day of freeway/expressway, undulating country roads and some secondary dirt roads, then a week of city/suburban commuting before I can give an assessment of the latest changes.

We are starting to "split hairs" with the programing and what suits my requirements and expectations on any given day may not suit someone else's. I am convinced that Auto Mate will never be as perfect as Lockup Mate when you absolutely nail the timing of the gear changes in any particular circumstance, but like a manual trans this takes a lot of time and practice to get a seamless perfect gear change in all conditions. Auto Mate's up and down gear changes and the programing of the TC lockup is much better than the factory program and also better than factory sports mode. It reduces the load on the engine, engine inlet & coolant temperatures, reduces ATF temperatures and more of the engines power and torque actually reaches the drive wheels, add in some fuel saving, and all this from switching Auto Mate Mate on and selecting "D". If and when you want more control then use the sports mode/paddles and enjoy the driver override/input of having a clutchless manual transmission.

OK.

[old Jack]

Hi Coughy,

The operation of the switch/led combination is easy.
1. Press the switch and you get the blue LED brightly flash once. Now both Auto Mate and Lockup Mate are ready to function once the ATF has reached 40C. The factory TC lockup requires the ATF to be at 40C for smooth TC lockup operation. The blue LED continuously pulses faintly until the ATF is up to temp. The blue LED comes ON when the TC is locked. There is an auto dimming function for night time which is linked to the headlight operation, however there is a "bright" over ride function that allows for daylight indication with the headlights on.
2. Auto Mate will lock the TC up in 2nd, 3rd, 4th and 5th when the conditions are OK for TC lockup operation then engine rpm, engine load, vehicle speed and accelerator position inputs are all used by the MM4x4 ECU to control up and down gear shift points and TC lock and unlock. You just drive the vehicle in "Drive".
3. There is a factory over ride function when in "Drive" that allows the driver to change up or down a gear as long as it is "safe" to do so, by using the steering wheel paddles and the trans will still automatically change down gears as you slow down. The factory program changes down from 3rd to 1st and skips 2nd but Auto Mate does not skip 2nd gear on the change down, this has improved the low speed operation of the auto trans, when you stop the trans reverts back to "Drive" ready for the next acceleration command. Auto Mate also keeps the TC locked up when it is "safe" so engine braking and ATF cooling is improved.
4. If you shift the gear selector to Semi Manual Sports Mode then you have full control over both up and down shifts. The factory program allows you to rev the engine to redline of 4,600rpm in 1,2,3 & 4 gears and 3,400 in 5th. Both Auto Mate and Lockup Mate limits rpm to 4,000rpm as we have found there is not benifet in allowing the engine to work harder, the 3,400 rpm factory set limit in 5th gear is retained.

Just like the factory AT program, there are times when the Auto Mate does not do what you think it should do, Auto Mate does this also because it is reactive to preset conditions and cannot see the road ahead or read your mind, just like the factory AT ECU. This is the time to either down or up shift using the paddles, such conditions are an earlier or later gear change, holding a set gear to prevent hunting or increased engine braking.

OJ.

[Ian H]

Very exciting progress with Automate, which I'm following closely.

My reason for getting it will be towing. Currently I'm towing a Tvan camper trailer which is around 1500kg, so it's not huge and I tow in 4th at around 95km/h, which keeps the trans temps around 60c. Doing that speed across the Nullarbor isn't ideal but if I change to 5th so I can travel a bit faster, the trans temp will go up over 20c to mid 80's and even more. I'm assuming this is because the TC isn't looking in 5th?

I like the idea of Auto Mate but maybe the first version would be just as good for my use ?

[old Jack]

It's close!

Got my Challenger back yesterday after another 2 weeks of MM4x4 development, now at version 12 of Auto Mate and it is almost ready for the first production unit to be made.

Yesterday I did a drive up SE freeway and through the hills to visit Chillpepperz, so I could test drive his new suspension and he could drive the latest version of Auto Mate.
I am very happy with the result, I can still get a better result from Lockup Mate when I get the up and down shift timing perfect but that takes time and practice. Auto Mate does these almost as good but all the time without any driver input.

It is so much better than the factory program. Proven benifets are reduced fuel consumption, reduce engine coolant and intake temperatures and reduced ATF temperatures, after 10,000km of hard testing my ATF is still clear, clean and pink/red, so that means less servicing costs also.

Lockup Mate has now been fitted to my Challenger for 15,500kms and Auto Mate for near 6,000kms, Marshall has had my Challenger on and off for more than 6 weeks and in between times I have been doing further drive tests. The results are good and have been well worthwhile the time and expense.

Marshall has done a short YouTube on V12 Auto Mate in my Challenger explaining how Auto Mate functions;

https://youtu.be/ink5EFmJ9Co

With Auto Mate you also get Lockup Mate which transforms the auto Challenger into a clutchless manual, great for towing, off road, hills or when you want a spirited drive.
Auto Mate has transformed the sluggishly lazy fuel guzzling auto Challenger, especially around the city, the trans is in the right gear all the time, the engine does not labour and the fuel economy is improved by 15% to 25% from my extensive testing. My Challenger sounds and feels quite different to drive compared to when it is in the factory "Drive" and "Sport Mode" gone is the sensation of driving with a rubber band feeling were the rpm fluctuates wildly with an unlocked high slip torque convertor. You can notice the gear changes but these are not harsh or abrupt, but what you really notice is the improved responsiveness of the car to accelerator inputs and improved fuel economy.

OJ.

[Ian H]

Thanks for the update OJ and the video from Marshall is a great help too. I realist that this is all about the Challenger but I'm assuming it will be similar in the Paj?

[m_and_m]

Thanks for the update OJ - you beat me to it.

It's been a couple of weeks since my last update.
Once again OJ's car spent last week with me. I think we've now clocked over 5000km of development and testing. Many mornings up till 1 am testing and refining it this week.

I have now essentially completed auto-mate for the Challenger with all features now included. So the focus is now on getting it ready for release i.e. ordering parts for production, operating manuals etc....plus any minor tweaks to the sw over then next couple of weeks as OJ continues to test/critique. We also have a chance to tune up low range operation this weekend while in the Flinders Ranges.

I've resolved the earlier problems with the transmission being a bit 'bumpy'. 90% of the time gear changes are now smooth and I'm really happy with its performance. With auto-mate I find it a much nicer car to drive. I've also had feedback from several lockup-mate owners who have definitely confirmed it's resolved their LIMP problems. Some pretty happy folks out there

I've had many requests for a video of auto-mate.
Here's a youtube video showing auto-mate's features and operation. It includes subtitles if you need them.
OJ's link above was an early version over the video, and that link is now broken. OJ- you may want to update it. Just been top and tailed - No need to replay it if you seen it already.

https://youtu.be/nPrlY2lgxLo

Pajero is next...
The operation of the LED and the instrument cluster display will be different in the Pajero, as I have much more control over the instrument cluster compared to challenger. The challenger can display either 1-5 or D, but not both simultaneously. The Pajero, however, can have the green D and the gear number displayed simultaneously, and the LED could just indicate if the torque converter is locked or not. Final operation is still to be decided. Remaining features will be pretty much the same.

[pb4x2]

auto mate

Hi O.J. and Marshall,
Again,thank you for your update.Looking forward to its release and fitting a unit to my Challenger. The video is brilliant as is the product.

Darryl

[chillipepperz]

I had the privilege to spend some time with OJ on Saturday and also experience driving his Challenger with the latest version of Auto Mate installed. Having driven OJ’s car with an earlier version a month or so ago, I immediately noticed the positive difference.

This version has transformed the vehicle immensely. Gone is the standard mushy throttle response and slower than expected pick up- the transmission feels far more connected to the right foot than standard and I noted a much lighter amount of throttle required overall. The gear changes (particularly down) were smoother than before, in fact I recall only one down change that was noticeable. I like the use of the blue LED and the inclusion of the gear number on the main instrument panel even when in auto.

In our comparison drive with OJ driving my Challenger we noted that the fuel usage numbers were around 2L/100 better in OJ’s than mine. I understand the quirks of the dash fuel readout, but it’s a comparison of sorts never the less and I think OJ has reduced fuel records over time. Auto Mate is a good thing!

Cheers!
Andrew