I've broken a coil spring in Mongolia

[kiwi1973]

Prior to shipping to Russia I wanted to upgrade the rear coils. After some analysis - assisted by the views here - I decided Kings KCRR-35-EHD's would be the most optimal, but they weren't available at the time. I spoke with Kings at the time and was told that as they manufacture for other brands I could try one of them. In the end I ordered and fitted Tough Dog TDC635HH, which I initially hoped would be a re-branded KCRR-35-EHD, but they turned out to be a rebranded KCRR-35HD-SP. With no alternatives at the time (shipping date was looming) I fitted the SP's, which didn't give quite the lift I wanted, but did firm up the ride quite nicely and stopped the aux tank from bottoming out on compression.

Now I've broken the rear right side coil, whether we call it a TDC635HH or a KCRR35HD-SP.

I know that I am not the first to have broken an 'SP' coil. I recall Steve Mc broke a coil. That failure was attributed to travelling 1,000 of the CSR with a failed shock absorber.

There's no good reason for my coil breaking. We've been doing lots of off-road, but nothing that any decent coil shouldn't be perfectly fine with. I have Koni HT 88 series rear shocks, which were rebuilt by the NZ Koni agent prior to shipping, so my rear shocks are fine.

Anyway, will be contacting Kings today, and off to downtown Ulaanbaatar to see what coils are available here.

Awesome new video of the Gobi Desert coming very soon by the way!

[old Jack]

Hi Aaron,


It does not surprise me you have broken a SP coil as these are tapered wire and variable pitch progressive coil. It is highly likely this coil will break again with your use!

An alternative coil is KCRR-35EHD, I have fitted these to both "Pajero 12's" Gen 4 with 15mm spacers spacers and "Njswb's" Gen 4 with airbags and both these Pajero's carry weight really well and have proved reliable on extended trips and a Simpson Desert crossing.

King KCRR-35-EHD is a progressive rate coils with a spring rate of 15.17kg/mm through to 25kg/mm so this coil really handle GVM loads and deep compressions well. At 560mm ride height it will carry about 1550kg but at 530mm ride height it will carry 1760kg.

If you want a heavier coils again they will be to hard and high when you are unloaded, even with fridge drawers, tools. recovery gear in the rear cargo area permanently.

Old Man Emu PN 3111 is an EHD progressive rate coil 410mm free height spring rate 12.5kg/mm to 15kg/mm at ride height 560mm the rear axle wight calculates at 1850kg.

Old Mann Emu PN 3112 is a EHD linear rate coils with a spring rate of 17.45kg/mm so at ride height 560mm it will carry 1964kgs!




Just PM or email if you need more assistance.


Regards,


OJ.

[kiwi1973]

Thanks OJ.

Tough Dog market these as rated for a constant 500kg load, so they should have survived, even if less optimal than Kings EHD's (the TDC635HH is Tough Dog's EHD). Technically they should have been considerably stronger than the Lovell's CRR92's I had. I've added some photos - you may be surprised to see that the spring has broken about the middle rather than at an end.

Also note an upper control arm bush isn't looking too good - those bushes were also replaced just before I headed off on this trip and I'm inclined to suspect its failure may be linked to the failure of the spring (the bush on the other side is fine).

I've failed to find a replacement spring today in Ulaanbaatar. The guy was good enough to phone someone from the Mongolian Pajeroclub, who recommended that I get a pair of 80 series rear springs and cut them down to suit. Somehow I wonder if they meant front, not rear, as we know that spacers for the front of an 80 series fits the rear of Pajeros. Anyone heard of 80 series coils, front or rear, being used in a Pajero?

I phoned Kings, since they made these Toughdog branded springs. They were supposed to email me today to see if they could DHL express me some EHD's, though they haven't responded.

I have 9 days left on my Mongolian visa and am not permitted to extend it again. Failure to get this sorted soon means we'll be subject to fines. Better than Russia at least, where it would result in arrest.

[NJV6]

Oh dear, hope you get it sorted.

[nj swb]

Damn!

Sorry to hear of this problem, and that Kings haven't called you back.

For what it's worth, I still have my OME 995 coils in a box in my garage - yours for the cost of the freight, if that's of any use at all? OJ can probably help with more specs than I'll ever have, and I should be able to get them to a freight office tomorrow if that helps?

Check this post. I had SteveMc's old SPs, which replaced the above OMEs. As per linked thread, when I swapped back to the OME 995s there was literally no change in ride height - to the mm.

Not EHDs, but if the SPs got you this far the OMEs might keep you going until you can get some Kings EHDs (which went in when the OMEs came out, and I'd happily have them again).

Presuming you have some time on your hands, I'd suggest trying to find some 80 series springs - if you can provide some measurements of wire thickness, turns and free length OJ might be able to give some guidance on any potential as a solution.

[old Jack]

Hi Aaron,

PM sent with offer of assistance.

As a temporary fix, you could remove the coil and do a weld repair but don't grind the weld flush, then remove the airbag but leave the upper rubber airbag spacer/protector in place, then fit 6-8 good quality tennis balls ins the coils as you refit it.
Looks like you have punctured an airbag when the coil snapped.
This will take a lot of the load off the coil and still maintain an acceptable ride height. You can adjust the ride height by adding or removing a ball.

https://www2.pajeroclub.com.au/forum/showthread.php?t=32385

Factory coil has 19mm diameter wire, coils diameter of 153mm, a free length of 350mm and best guess about 7 to 8 turns.


OJ.

[Nab]

Can you temporarily use fencing wire or similar to wind the 2 coils together (that are currently touching)? Not ideal but might get you to the next major town

[geopaj]

Hi Aaron,

PM sent with offer of assistance.

As a temporary fix, you could remove the coil and do a weld repair but don't grind the weld flush, then remove the airbag but leave the upper rubber airbag spacer/protector in place, then fit 6-8 good quality tennis balls ins the coils as you refit it.
Looks like you have punctured an airbag when the coil snapped.
This will take a lot of the load off the coil and still maintain an acceptable ride height. You can adjust the ride height by adding or removing a ball.

https://www2.pajeroclub.com.au/forum/showthread.php?t=32385

Factory coil has 19mm diameter wire, coils diameter of 153mm, a free length of 350mm and best guess about 7 to 8 turns.


OJ.

I was thinking of suggesting the same - definately not ideal but should allow you to exit the country.

I remember years ago having a broken leaf spring welded back together - it lasted about 1,100km to get home

[kiwi1973]

For what it's worth, I still have my OME 995 coils in a box in my garage - yours for the cost of the freight, if that's of any use at all? OJ can probably help with more specs than I'll ever have, and I should be able to get them to a freight office tomorrow if that helps?

Thanks so much for the kind and generous offer! However, as I'm going to have to air freight a set of coils its best I ship over the correct rate springs, especially given the freight cost will outweigh the cost of the springs themselves. Plus, I still have a long way to go to England (and following that North Africa) so I need the right springs now.

I looked into 80 series coils, but found the steel thickness and spring rates to be very low by Pajero standards, presumably reflecting the different build of these two vehicles and hence unsprung weights the respective springs are designed to accommodate.

After visiting ARB Mongolia today, I've now officially exhausted all options to source springs here and will need to express freight some springs to Mongolia. Quite how I'm going to go about this is not 100% clear yet. I'm awaiting some kind of acknowledgement from the embassy that they're ok with me overstaying while I attend to the repair, but may have to get an order underway before I have this (assuming I get it at all!). OJ has kindly offered to assist, however it remains unclear whether Kings are presently working on any kind of assistance. I phoned them again today and was promised I would get at least an acknowledgement email today, but this didn't eventuate. They understand the predicament so if they're not interested in assisting I'd appreciate being told this straight up so I can move forward with other options. I'll phone them for a 3rd and final time first thing in the morning.

I also phone Tough Dog today. They weren't overly interested in assisting in any way - just put it through as a warranty claim with the retailer was their advice. Just a shame I replaced the Lovell's CRR92's at all, as although slightly underrated for our weight, I'm pretty darned sure they wouldn't be broken now. In contrast Tough Dog's marketing boasts how their product (which is actually made by Kings) is some of the toughest 4wd suspension in the world and totally suited to international off-road expeditions.... they didn't even last 4 months, of which 6 weeks my Pajero was in a container. Sorry, just getting frustrated. I knew something like this would occur on this trip at some point, but it shouldn't have been the brand new 500kg constant load springs, which neither Tough Dog nor Kings presently seem to concerned about.

[kiwi1973]

Top marks to King Springs!

Kings weren't ignoring me and had been hoping I would call back, as there seems to have been an issue with emails. They are offering to supply me a set of KCRR35EHD's free of charge, though I will need to pay the $420 DHL air freight bill. I think this is a very fair offer in the circumstances and demonstrates that Kings are a good company to deal with. The Aussie retailer who sold the broken spring hasn't been responsive at all. I appreciate good after sales service and think it fair to give due credit here to Kings for assisting.

Also big thanks to Pajeroclub members who made offers of assistance. OJ was going to help me with sourcing springs in need, so thanks again.

The dominant vehicles here in Mongolia are pretty much all made by Toyota. Same in Russia too. For cars, the Toyota Prius is dominant. For 4wd's it's Toyota Landcruisers. Not Prado's, but the full size 80, 100 (including plenty of 105's too) and 200's. Few Pajero's and perhaps surprisingly even very few of the solid axle Patrols to be seen.

In Russia especially I saw many Y62 Patrol's, though only in use on-road. These and the petrol V8 Landcruisers are popular here because quality high octane petrol is about a third of the NZ price (don't know what you guys in Aussie pay for petrol, but I'll assume similar to NZ). Also the petrol models may have an advantage in the minus 40 to minus 60 degree Celsius winters.

The only other vehicles that are very popular off-road in Mongolia are the old Soviet 4x4 vans and Mitsubishi Delica 4wd's. Loads of Delica's - about the only Mitsubishi's frequently seen here.

Apart from this issue with the springs my Pajero is going great here. We've done loads of off-road work now and the Pajero feels very much in its element. I note however that if I had a full size Landcruiser the springs I need now would have been an on-the-shelf item here in Ulaanbaatar.

[nj swb]

Kings weren't ignoring me and had been hoping I would call back, as there seems to have been an issue with emails. They are offering to supply me a set of KCRR35EHD's free of charge, though I will need to pay the $420 DHL air freight bill. I think this is a very fair offer in the circumstances and demonstrates that Kings are a good company to deal with. The Aussie retailer who sold the broken spring hasn't been responsive at all. I appreciate good after sales service and think it fair to give due credit here to Kings for assisting.

Good to hear!

Your experience with the retailer isn't totally unexpected. It seems (to me) that more and more retailers fail to understand that the consumer has a contract with the retailer, not the manufacturer. If the part fails, it is the retailer's responsibility to honour warranty, then take it up with the manufacturer.

Full marks to the manufacturer for stepping up when their distribution chain dropped the ball. Kings deserve kudos, and the other clowns have demonstrated where they belong in the market.

Fingers crossed that DHL come through for you too. Do you have an ETA on the new springs yet?

[old Jack]

Agree, good on Kings for coming to the party
The DHL charge of $421 is also a good price for door to door airfreight given the size and weight of the coils and the destination.

From the photo you posted it looks like the airbag is stuffed, so I repeat my comments of removing the airbags but leaving the upper protector disc of the airbag kit in place, this way if you find that the coils are too soft you maybe able to jack the body up so the suspension is at full droop and insert some tennis balls to give you some extra spring rate. I know this works on live axle coil spring suspensions but I have never tried it on independent coil setup.

OJ.

[kiwi1973]

From the photo you posted it looks like the airbag is stuffed,

OJ.

Actually it may be ok, as it wasn't inflated at the time, this because there was a bit of a leak affecting one side only, which was creating uneven rear suspension a few hours after pumping up. I let both bags down and was intending to get around to fixing up the leak, which I expect will be in the tubing connections. I hope to attend to the leak when installing the new springs. It's great that I'm getting KCRR35EHD, as these should be the last springs I ever need to install.

[RUGGA]

The guy was good enough to phone someone from the Mongolian Pajeroclub, .

Did you reach out to the Russian Pajeroclub for assistance? Too far, expensive?

I thought you had the best camp fire story already with your busted bearings in Morocco but Ulaanbaatar, what a wonderful place to have a story about a broken spring. Its on my list. I hope your video includes some drone footage (if allowed) of approx 60km east of the centre.

Great to hear you are getting your chosen springs in the end. When do you expect the springs to arrive? Any news from the embassy?

Keep enjoying this amazing time and adventure with your family. Travel well Kiwi

[erad]

Back here in Oz (and probably the rest of the world), there is a lot pf media coverage about the 50th anniversary of the moon landing. To loosely quote Mission control after they landed, "There's bunch of guys here who have been turning blue, but are now breathing".

Well, with you, it is rather similar - there's a lot of people here who are following your travels with baited breath, and who gasped when you announced the broken spring. Not that we can do much, but be assured everyone here is keenly following your moves. Hope this setback doesn't muck up your future border crossings, or delay your ultimate arrival at the end of your trip.