Below Nav Bar

Collapse

Tips on Buying Fuel

Collapse
This is a sticky topic.
X
X
 
  • Filter
  • Time
  • Show
Clear All
new posts
  • amr75wcr
    Valued Member
    • Dec 2009
    • 1543
    • Sunny Coast

    Tips on Buying Fuel

    Got this sent to me today, anyone out there able to confirm, it certainly does make sense!

    TIPS ON PUMPING PETROL



    I don't know what you guys are paying for Petrol.... but

    here in Melbourne we are paying up to $1.30 to $1.50 per litre. My line

    of work is in petroleum for about 31 years now, so here are some tricks

    to get more of your money's worth for every Litre:



    Here at the Shell Pipeline where I work in Melbourne, we deliver

    about 4 million litres in a 24-hour period thru the pipeline.. One day

    is diesel the next day is jet fuel, and Petrol, regular and premium

    grades. We have 34-storage tanks here with a total capacity of

    16,800,000 Litres.



    Only buy or fill up your car or truck in the early morning when

    the ground temperature is still cold. Remember that all service stations

    have their storage tanks buried below ground. The colder the ground the

    more dense the Petrol, when it gets warmer Petrol expands, so

    buying in the afternoon or in the evening....your litre is not exactly

    a litre. In the petroleum business, the specific gravity and the

    temperature of the Petrol, diesel and jet fuel, ethanol and other

    petroleum products plays an important role.



    A 1-degree rise in temperature is a big deal for this business.

    But the service stations do not have temperature compensation at the

    pumps.



    When you're filling up do not squeeze the trigger of the nozzle

    to a fast mode If you look you will see that the trigger has three (3)

    stages: low, middle, and high. You should be pumping on low mode,

    thereby minimizing the vapors that are created while you are pumping.

    All hoses at the pump have a vapor return. If you are pumping on the

    fast rate, some of the liquid that goes to your tank becomes vapor.

    Those vapors are being sucked up and back into the underground storage

    tank so you're getting less worth for your money.


    One of the most important tips is to fill up when your Petrol

    tank is HALF FULL. The reason for this is the more Petrol you have in

    your tank the less air occupying its empty space. Petrololine evaporates

    faster than you can imagine. Petrol storage tanks have an internal

    floating roof. This roof serves as zero clearance between the Petrol and

    the atmosphere, so it minimizes the evaporation. Unlike service

    stations, here where I work, every truck that we load is temperature

    compensated so that every litre is actually the exact amount.



    Another reminder, if there is a Petrol truck pumping into

    the storage tanks when you stop to buy Petrol, DO NOT fill up; most

    likely the Petrol is being stirred up as the Petrol is being

    delivered, and you might pick up some of the dirt that normally settles

    on the bottom.

    04 NP DID GLX ARB Steel Bullbar 2" ARB/King Springs, Billies, Warn Winch, Rhino Track Mount Racks, Rola Basket, Rallye 4000 HID, UHF, Reverse camera, Custom Console, Fridge Slide and Rear Door Table, DVD Screen, 40lt Engel, Dual Battery Sytem with Auto Isolator, Cargo Barrier, polaris gps, Sat Phone, BFG A/Ts, Foxwing awning, ARB Locker, Bush Skinz sliders $ inter plate, 3" exhaust chip, custom bar & twin tyres

    And a PB Challenger with a list if goodies getting as long as the Paj
  • HSV Rangie
    Valued Member
    • Feb 2010
    • 1340
    • Hastings

    #2
    excellent.
    2016 NX,GLS,DID,Auto. Rear DL, ARB deluxe BB, Warn winch, Safari Snorkle, Tow bar, Redarc tow pro, Front door windows tinted, Traxide SC80 dual battery system, Rino roof bars, Icom IC440 UHF, Lovells HD + 50mm springs all round, ????? shocks and struts, Proclip & Strike phone mount.

    Comment

    • Gus
      Administrator
      • Mar 2008
      • 4074
      • Traralgon. Vic

      #3
      Great advice..

      Gus.

      (I'll put a temporary sticky on this so everyone gets a read)
      VX 200 Series 4.5L Twin Turbo-Diesel V8 Landcruiser HERE
      NM Exceed 3.2 DID Auto Pajero. (SOLD) With a few Mods. HERE

      How to get Forum Decals

      Comment

      • Herman4x4
        Valued Member
        • Oct 2009
        • 2231
        • Melton, Victoria

        #4
        I always thought the floating roof on the tanks in the refineries was to minimise the space for fumes which are a bigger risk for explosion than the fuel itself.
        I like the theory on filling up in the morning.
        Cheers,
        Andrew.
        Cheers,
        Andrew.



        2008 NS Diesel Auto - stock as a rock. Planning Tow bar, dual battery system, cargo barrier, bullbar, winch, lights, roof rack and suspension.
        Jayco Starcraft 17.58-3.

        Comment

        • Fogger
          Member
          • Oct 2009
          • 73
          • Sydney

          #5
          I would have thought that underground tank temperatures wouldn't change all that much between day and night. It would depend on how deep they are. The ground above the tanks is usually shaded for most of the day at most of the service stations near me. I can understand that it would be a problem for above ground tanks for sure.

          But if the fuel is delivered at one temperature, and the underground tanks equalise at another temperature, there probably would be a time when the fuel would be the coldest and most dense. Either just before or just after a delivery would be my guess without knowing the details. It's all food for thought though.
          '93 NH LWB GLX 3.0ltr Manual. Freshly rebuilt engine. Aussie Alloy Bullbar, Formula Offroad Sidesteps, King 15x7 Terra Black Wheels, 31x10.5R15 Maxxis Bighorns, HD Rear Springs, Driving Lights, 7" in-dash Audio/GPS.

          Comment

          • Goodsy
            Who ya gunna call....
            • Dec 2010
            • 7598
            • Hervey Bay

            #6
            Good read but where the area i fill up in is cheapest on Thursday or Friday buy over 10 cents a litre! This difference in price will not make up for any fuel temp diff etc.

            Maybe you can answer how fuel can go from $1.26 to $1.39 in 12 hours.
            .Previously an NP GLX 3.8 auto RIP
            NS VRX DiD auto. RIP.

            Comment

            • Pickle
              Administrator
              • Jun 2007
              • 6886
              • All over Oz

              #7
              Originally posted by Goodsy View Post
              Maybe you can answer how fuel can go from $1.26 to $1.39 in 12 hours.
              And who Shell supplies to?
              Dave
              NX Pampas Cat GLS MY16
              Member 1228 Pajero Club

              Comment

              • amr75wcr
                Valued Member
                • Dec 2009
                • 1543
                • Sunny Coast

                #8
                Originally posted by Goodsy View Post
                Good read but where the area i fill up in is cheapest on Thursday or Friday buy over 10 cents a litre! This difference in price will not make up for any fuel temp diff etc.

                Maybe you can answer how fuel can go from $1.26 to $1.39 in 12 hours.
                Because they are theiving bastards!
                04 NP DID GLX ARB Steel Bullbar 2" ARB/King Springs, Billies, Warn Winch, Rhino Track Mount Racks, Rola Basket, Rallye 4000 HID, UHF, Reverse camera, Custom Console, Fridge Slide and Rear Door Table, DVD Screen, 40lt Engel, Dual Battery Sytem with Auto Isolator, Cargo Barrier, polaris gps, Sat Phone, BFG A/Ts, Foxwing awning, ARB Locker, Bush Skinz sliders $ inter plate, 3" exhaust chip, custom bar & twin tyres

                And a PB Challenger with a list if goodies getting as long as the Paj

                Comment

                • puppy
                  Member
                  • Jul 2011
                  • 141
                  • NSW

                  #9
                  the temp in the underground tank will rise thru the day , as for every litre of petrol pumped out to a customers car one litre of warm air is returned to the underground tank. dont know how significant this would be tho.

                  i would pay 10 cents a litre for the right to buy petrol at 1.39 a litre - you guys have it good.


                  cheers

                  Comment

                  • Jords
                    Valued Member
                    • Jun 2011
                    • 595
                    • Kellyville Ridge

                    #10
                    Im prety sure that tanks are at least 2 meters undergound and the temperature variance would be minimal hence why people live underground at places like cooper pedy etc...and if you look around a petrol station you will notice venting pipes to allow air and gas flow once the air is underground it would equalise as air does not hold temps all that long. Having said all that the density difference would be measured in millilitres not litres. You will save more using your coles and woolies vouchers!
                    2007 NS VRX Cool Siver, Mitsu Alloy BB with spotties, MM towbar, Family Pack, ARB Awning, Duel battery with Optima yellow top starter, Bushskinz intercooler and sump combo, 2" lift with Bilstein shocks and HD Lovels, Ultragauge (Sold 2014)

                    Comment

                    • goldnugget
                      Senior Member
                      • Jan 2011
                      • 348
                      • Qld

                      #11
                      Handy tips, thanks.
                      I know that LPG you get more for your buck when colder temps are around (early AM). I always have my 8.5 kg lpg cylinders filled first thing in the morning from BCF (I use them on my house for hot water), and I swear I get at least a week extra out of them when filled early morning instead of later in the heat of the day.
                      Also as far as fuel density, I remember one of the current affairs shows doing tests on pump delivey litres vs real litres, ethonol content etc etc (you know they do these at least once a year), and they showed the diference in fuel quantity when heated and cooled in a controlled environment. I cant remember the percentage in volume change per degrees in temp but if you googled it I'm sure you will find a table somewhere.
                      As far as fuel cycling....they can do it because the government lets them. I think from what limmited research I had done on this in the past suggests that Australia is one of the only places in the western world ( if not the whole world) where petrol price cycling is allowed to occur, and because they often fall on the majority of pay days, it is in the governments interests as well since the state and fed get so much percentage per litre. Because the government wont stop it, the fuel companies wont either.

                      Comment

                      • Avanner
                        Member
                        • Jul 2007
                        • 151

                        #12
                        O.K....you are going to get some smart*rse who will dispute anything...but anyway I'll stick my neck out here!

                        MYTH: Fill up in the morning when it’s cooler: An underground 35,000-gallon tank does not change temperature very much from midnight to midday.

                        A one degree difference in fuel temperature will make a difference of about a kilometer in a tank fill of 20 US gallons (75 Litres roughly)

                        The pumps in fuel bowsers and their crude flow meters are most accurate at full flow rates, at a slow rate they will measure unfairly to the customer.

                        Roy

                        Comment

                        • goldnugget
                          Senior Member
                          • Jan 2011
                          • 348
                          • Qld

                          #13
                          Here is a consumer watchdog report from the US http://www.consumerwatchdog.org/reso...lUSAJune07.pdf almost half a gallon diference based on the 20 you suggested, but with larger temp diference.
                          The big issue, as stated in the report...even though there are only a few degrees diference in some cases, there is more of a disparity between wholesale temperature compenstated pricing and retail sale by volume.
                          Also interesting discussion on this thread http://www.consumerwatchdog.org/reso...lUSAJune07.pdf regards to fuel expansion and temps (particularly page 2 about overflow/vented tanks.
                          Obviously your location in this wide land of ours will also depend on the actual results that may be recieved.
                          As far as flow rates and accuracy.....I guess it would depend on the calibration of the pump at various stages...I'm not in the industry so I wouldnt know.

                          So, in effect, if we ran some radiator/heater hoses through the fuel tank or on the fuel return line, we should be able to go further on a tank because the volume of petrol would expand...but how does (or does it?) affect the octane rating in various temps?
                          I know ...its late.....goodnight

                          Comment

                          • dryzoned
                            Member
                            • Aug 2009
                            • 116
                            • Willunga, South Australia

                            #14
                            All excellent fodder for thought.
                            If my late night maths is right, wholesale is at ~14'C which might be reasonable for underground storage during most of the year, but with delivery at say 35'C the report suggests an effective ~2% price increase.
                            Daily price variation is much more volatile?
                            Aren't vehicle fuel tanks sealed (i.e. the pressure release when you open the cap), so we shouldnt be losing any vapours when closed regardless of the tank being full, half empty, or whatever?

                            My query though is raised by my LPG service guy who says you get what you pay for. Cheaper LPG often contains more water that leads to premature rusting of the tank. And less fuel economy too. Cheaper petrol similarly has to cost less to the supplier. Probably by less octane?
                            The nett effect is, I now only accumulate flying points not fuel discounts or I shop at Coles. ( I dont work for any retailers or fuel companies.)

                            $.02
                            Cheers - David
                            NS Exceed 2006 Auto, Petrol+LPG, UHF, rear polybags,M/T STZ's, My roof-rack, My cargo-storage, Thumper, ++ Avan Tayla; picasaweb.google.com/Dryzoned
                            Replaced NH GLX Auto, Petrol of 15 years.
                            My convoy name was beervan, but when it had all gone my callsign changed.... and has stayed that ever since.

                            Comment

                            • woody
                              Member
                              • Sep 2011
                              • 58
                              • Karratha

                              #15
                              This makes for an interesting discussion but we'd probably save more money on petrol by winding up our windows at the end of the day
                              Deceased: 2002 3.5 GLS auto, ECB alloy bullbar, ECB alloy tubular sidesteps, Mickey Thompson ATZ 4 ribs 265/75/16, Reverse camera, Alpine stereo, 2 inch sd lovells springs + lovells shocks, custom 3mm steel sump guard, freebie 220mm spotlights, rola roof racks, oricom uhf. Claimed by a dodgy Kangaroo Island road and an inexperienced and remorseful girlfriend.

                              Now driving a prado 120 gxl and secretly missing the paj!

                              Comment

                              Matched content

                              Collapse
                              Working...
                              X