Not Cool!

[mooreyfiveo]

you do realize the the pollen filter is due to be changed at the 45k service ...
and at every 12 month intervals (as I just had my 45k done) - and I know they changed it cause the mechanic/apprentice left his paw prints there ;-) ...

Yep, thanks. I've marked it with a pen so I can double check they do it.
Main concern is the hot air that blows through the vents even on first start up of the day.

[Ent]

Hi

In Tassie Aircons are not that much hard press but my Challenger on is not very strong. In fact even on a mildly warm day it struggles. And yes I have checked and cleaned the filter. Very curious if dealer will at the 45k service. My guess is good dealers do, and bad dealers do not, and MMAL does not give a hoot what happens there.

[Natator]

I recently had a hire car and it was that which made me realize how utterly pathetic my a/c in the Paj was, especially in terms of blowing power.

Found this thread when looking for solutions. Fixed the pollen filter, which was coated in a very thick layer of fine red dust.

Wow, what a massive improvement!!! Cost me nothing, filter takes under a minute to get out/in, and I spent maybe 10 mins cleaning it.

Got to love this place, it's such a wealth of information.

[SwampFox55]

Heatwaves and Challenging Air Cons

This note is for those ‘folk’ who carry a pet in the back of their Challenger.

Now that the hot weather has arrived in earnest, it’s prudent to think about the effect of heat on pets in the back of your car. Your beloved pet can’t tell you they’re about to pass out from heat stroke when it’s cool up front but hot in the back, where they are. A couple of years ago I placed a thermometer on the top of my dog’s plastic pet carrier in the cargo compartment to find it was 31C after an hour of driving with the AC on! While we were comfortable up front, the dog was nearly fainting down the back. She’d looked a bit wobbly on her feet a few times when I’d taken her out of the carrier on hot days, so I thought I’d check the temperature and was horrified. After that little revelation I bought a large wire cage carrier for the dog, increased the AC fan speed and pointed the air vents upward to get more AC air into the back of the car on hot days. However, this was still insufficient and so on hot days we have the dog in the front passenger’s foot-well and select the air vents to face and foot. Lucky she’s a small dog. By this stage you might get the idea that the AC system is barely serviceable with only four face vents up front and such a long and deep cabin with two rows of seat backs acting as barriers to airflow from the AC vents in the dash. Now as there is nothing that can be done about this situation, I am just bringing it to people’s attention to keep in mind for work arounds when carrying pets in the back on hot days.

As the daily temps increased a couple of months ago I expected my PB’s AC must be in need of a re-gas as it wasn’t coping with 30 degree plus days. It had never been as good as the AC in my other car and was only getting worse. I first cleaned the pollen filter (before, during and after photos are enclosed) to improve the airflow; I had a new one fitted a while ago and saw no reason to throw it out. Then I had the AC system re-gassed. This cost $150 from my local Mitsy Indi - half the price the dealer quoted. The mechanic removed 590 grams of refrigerant and re-filled it with 650 grams (the spec range is 630 - 670). So the quantity was only down 10%. After the service the mechanic told me the face vent temp got down to 7C before the pump would switch off (normal for Mitsies he’d worked on), whereas most other brands get down to 6C. When I’d checked it two years ago it never got lower than 12C. The practical difference is that before the re-gas with the AC set to the coldest setting and the face vents selected, the fan speed would normally be set to 2 or 3 and occasionally 4. After the re-gas, the fan is now set to 1 or 2 and occasionally 3 but then, only for short periods eg after engine starts.

Yesterday, with the OAT at 38C, I put a thermometer in the shaded centre of the cargo compartment, 200mm above the floor, just too see if I can move the dog back into the cargo compartment on hot days. When I got home from an albeit, short trip, the cargo compartment temperature was 38C. While it was fine up front, it was totally unacceptable in the cargo compartment, where a pet may be carried. I’ve been doing numerous long trips recently and unless the fan speed is set at 3 or 4 (which is too noisy) the cabin temp in the back struggles to cool down properly on very hot days. Another adverse factor on long drives is the exhaust pipe heating the rear floor above it. I had previously measured the floor temperature on the RHS of the cargo compartment at 37C in the shade after one hour’s drive with the AC on, due to the exhaust pipe heat. Why do I mention this? Well if your pet carrier is on the floor the heat is transmitted directly to the carrier and then to the pet! It’s therefore a good idea to put the pet carrier on the LHS. My PB’s build date is May 2012 and has dealer fitted windscreen tinting, the weakest UV tinting I’ve ever had.

So, if you’re concerned about your Challenger’s AC, get it re-gassed. If you’re carrying pets in the cargo compartment in hot weather you may also need to take additional precautions, just as we have.

180107

[coughy]

i have just modifed my ac condenser fan with a manual over ride so i turn it on in the hot days so the fan in the front of the car runns 100% when engine starts and ac is much much colder now
factory it cycles on if the inside cabin temp is hot then it turns of well not any more

my ac is icey cold even the wifey said what did you do it is great oh and yes i have had it regased last year like swampfox said they only put in just enough to get it working right amount of gas make huge difference.

regas was from a little mishap i had with a pulley and a spanner and a hammer lol long story short thats for a nother day lol when doing the timing belt

[Alex86]

Swampfox, it might look a little crude but have you thought about trying to pipe some cold air down the back for the mutt?

A bit of that Flexi type pipe that you see on portable aircons, knock up a shroud to capture all the air from a vent or two, got to somehow stick the shroud to it though (3m picture hanging Velcro thingies?) and then run the pipe to the back. Removable, cheap. May be of benefit?
Or somehow stick the pipe on a floor outlet under the driver/front passenger seat and run the pipe back to the rear cargo area.

Wouldn't have a clue if it would be any good. But if you did give it a go it would be interesting to find out if it's any good.

Of course for those cars with rear air con, just turn that on!

[CC2005]

The service and technical manual lacks important detail for one to correctly assess the function and efficiency of air conditioning system. Some people have correctly assessed points of inspection. More detail is required to assess its operation correctly. There are many variables and comparing it to other makes and models will more than likely be misleading. And guessing what the leaving air temperatures should be, may not be very helpful.

The physical and operating functions of many parts must be also checked not limited to; compressor, condenser fan, evaporator fan, refrigeration expansion device(s), filters, operating refrigerant pressures and temperatures corresponding to *airflow, also taking into account-"dry and wet bulb temperatures" and the design refrigerant charge for the applicable system.

Take it to a reputable AC service centre, preferably to someone who has done a trade. Someone who will measure the air on and off dry and wet bulb temperatures, refrigerant high and low pressures in conjunction with doing the other checks. It may be as simple as adding more gas due to it being under charged, but you need to ensure the system is not leaking, or has moisture, air or other contaminants in the system. Still what is going to be difficult to assess is the actual capacity (total and sensible) unless the *airflow rate is known unless they have access to Mitsubishi criteria. Mitsubishi may be able to provide duct airflow rates or outlet velocities. But Mitsubishi with their air on and off temperatures at corresponding refrigerant pressures will be able to determine if it is functioning within their limits. The service center should test it to Mitsubishi's criteria, but I doubt most will have it.

The manual information details the fan must be operating on high, and the dry bulb temperatures and humidity range be between 30%-80% for the "air on" conditions. This is the air on temperature conditions for both the evaporator and condenser coils. The higher the humidity the greater the affect on the cooling capacity (loss of) and air off temperature sensed. What is interesting, they state the test should be conducted in the shade with all the doors and windows of the vehicle open, this means the condenser and evaporator will be operating at the same conditions. Importantly the air off temperatures shown in the manual will not be cabin only return air (recycled) temperatures, (and they are dry bulb temperatures only) this is why the temperature chart shows a higher air off range than expected; and is also reflected somewhat to the refrigerant operating pressures. It is also stated run the system for 10 minutes or more.

You can have 30°C day but with high humidity, (leaving dry bulb air temperature will be higher) your (sensible) cooling effect could half than what it could be on a 30°C day with low humidity depending on your designed system.

A very weird notation. They state in the manual that it is not good for your health to have the temperature more than 6°C different to the outside - really.

(Probably too many paragraphs for some.)

https://nofile.io/f/XJgfo45jhJx/Manuals+1.pdf

[way-t-go]

it will be low on gas i just had my condenser replace had wife take to local ac guy he filled it to 550grams and it wasn't getting as cold as it use to so i took it back showed him the manual and it states 630-670 grams so he put an extra 100 grams in now it is icy cold so yes the gas level makes a huge difference he wasn't aware that the challenger takes a 650 payload as all of the tritons take 550 and they happy
i told him challenger has a bigger condenser and he was happy

I was having the same problem with the A/C. It was down on gas, fridgy mechanic put in about 660 grams and all is good now.
He said years ago R12 gas was used (not good for enviroment) and if it was way low on gas it would still cool things down quite well, the new environmentally friendly gas on the other hand only has to loose a little bit of gas and it won't cool the cabin down.