265/70R17 Upgrade

[Mundy55]

I have a 2017 NX Exceed with standard wheels of 265/60R18 and is looking to upgrade.
.......I am doing about 90% bitumen and 10% sand. .......

Given this usage, it seems to me the value of the increased sidewall in 17" rims for off-roading would be somewhat academic. In any event, I think the purported value is small compared to tyre selection and driver skill. I'd suggest sticking with 18" rims and save your money.

[nj swb]

Given this usage, it seems to me the value of the increased sidewall in 17" rims for off-roading would be somewhat academic. In any event, I think the purported value is small compared to tyre selection and driver skill. I'd suggest sticking with 18" rims and save your money.

Undoubtedly sound logic.

To be devil's advocate, is the 10% sand including towing the 1.5T camper trailer?

If this is the case then I would be wanting to make things easier for the tow tug - what will provide the best traction on the sand?

I believe the longest footprint will come from the tallest sidewall. If money is no object, 265/70R17.

[Scooby]

Have you priced 18” tyres?
If your 18,s are worn out and you can get a set of 17” rims for under the $400 mark then the cost will be about the same if using the same branded tyre.
There is around $100 difference between 17 and 18s.

[no_brainer]

I was able to find a cheap set of 5 17" pajero rims so I now run the standard 265/60/R18 with Hankook RF10 as my daily driver and 265/70/R17 with Toyo Open Country or weekends and Camping. I currently have no lift and I have not had any scrubbing or other issues.

Couldn't be happier with the extra side wall bagging out even in sand the MT's don't get bogged down.

[Mundy55]

Whilst I understand why having 2 sets of tyres, one for on-road and one for off, has a nominal appeal, I don't really understand it from a practical and value for money perspective.

Pre-covid, I did about 100,000km in just over 4 years with one set of tyres (still with life in them). Whilst the time of use and frequency of city driving was much greater, the longer distances travelled off-road meant I did about the same distance on and off road. If I'd had 2 sets of tyres, then after 5 years, say, I'd have only used about half the tyres lives from a wear perspective. Another way of saying this is it would take about 10 years to use up the tyres from a wear perspective.

Most pundits suggest 5 years or so is the recommended life of a tyre from a hardening point of view and keeping tyres for 10 years would be unwise. So this means if you follow the 2 sets approach, you'd have to replace both sets well before their useful wear lives have been consumed, which is not value for money. Even if your use is not 50/50, one of the sets of tyres should be replaced even earlier than consumed wear life.

Like most issues, the solution is a compromise depending on how far, how frequent, and what type your use is, but I still can't see 2 sets of tyres ever being value for money.

[Seigried]

Its a personal choice. Ive done it in the past but I got over swapping tyres. No it does not make economic sense if your buying new tyres.

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[Dicko1]

Whilst I understand why having 2 sets of tyres, one for on-road and one for off, has a nominal appeal, I don't really understand it from a practical and value for money perspective.

Pre-covid, I did about 100,000km in just over 4 years with one set of tyres (still with life in them). Whilst the time of use and frequency of city driving was much greater, the longer distances travelled off-road meant I did about the same distance on and off road. If I'd had 2 sets of tyres, then after 5 years, say, I'd have only used about half the tyres lives from a wear perspective. Another way of saying this is it would take about 10 years to use up the tyres from a wear perspective.

Most pundits suggest 5 years or so is the recommended life of a tyre from a hardening point of view and keeping tyres for 10 years would be unwise. So this means if you follow the 2 sets approach, you'd have to replace both sets well before their useful wear lives have been consumed, which is not value for money. Even if your use is not 50/50, one of the sets of tyres should be replaced even earlier than consumed wear life.

Like most issues, the solution is a compromise depending on how far, how frequent, and what type your use is, but I still can't see 2 sets of tyres ever being value for money.

I use 2 sets and couldnt be happier. In the wet season up here I want as much road grip as I can get. My 697,s do a great job.Great grip on stinking hot days as well. AT or even mud tyres have nowhere near the grip of a good road tyre. Towing the camper i put the Generals AT2 on because I’ll end up off road. Previous use of 697,s has me vowing never to use them off road again. Had quite a few with side wall blowouts and blocks ripped to shreds by rocks. They are a softish tyre so they stay on the bitumen. I’ve never heard anyone say 5 years is about the life of a tyre. Some say 7 years, which for most people would be over 80,000klms anyways.


I normally swap them over 3-4 times a year. Takes about 40 minutes thanks to the 12 volt jack. Good chance to do tyre rotations as well.


Horses for course...but for me I have peace of mind and save money from destroying the Bridgestones too early.

[BruceandBobbi]

Its a personal choice. Ive done it in the past but I got over swapping tyres. No it does not make economic sense if your buying new tyres.

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Nothing makes economical sense when you own a 4X4.

[nj swb]

Nothing makes economical sense when you own a 4X4.

I understand, and agree 100%.

How do you explain to somebody who suggests you should fly to Broome & explore the Kimberley in a hire 4wd?

Spending all that time (& money) driving there and back doesn't make sense to "rational people", but anybody who must ask "why?" is unlikely to ever understand.

I find it's easiest to accept we're crazy, and enjoy that we have huge expanses of respite from "sensible people". Let's face it - do we really want them to learn what we know?

[old Jack]

Nothing makes economical sense when you own a 4X4.

The same can be said for many things we own or aspire to own.
High Performance Sports Cars and motor bikes.
Vintage and Classic Cars and motor bikes.
Boats, especially large boats.
Large Caravans, when you want to get away from it all and still take it all with you.
Large Houses with rooms we do not use.

As for the fly in and hire a 4wd, this is a major problem in all parts of the country.
People driving on the wrong side of the road, people driving beyond their and the vehicles capabilities. People not understanding the environmental conditions.
There are many accidents and incidences caused by ill informed, poorly prepared and low skilled travellers, these people rely on the goodwill of the experienced and prepared travellers to help them out when things turn pear shape.

The Gibb River Road will be fully bitumised within 5 years, the jump ups have been tar for about 10 years!

At some stage the only way to see and stay at many places will sadly be with commercial operators who will get priority, and restrictions on private individuals will increase through an expensive and limited permit system. I experience this already with bushwalking on iconic walks that are now "famous tourist walks" both overseas and in Australia.

I am glad I made the most of my youth and explored Australia in the early 1980's.
Not many people can say they have experienced our natural wonders independently and without crowds.

OJ.

[Dicko1]

The same can be said for many things we own or aspire to own.
High Performance Sports Cars and motor bikes.
Vintage and Classic Cars and motor bikes.
Boats, especially large boats.
Large Caravans, when you want to get away from it all and still take it all with you.
Large Houses with rooms we do not use.

As for the fly in and hire a 4wd, this is a major problem in all parts of the country.
People driving on the wrong side of the road, people driving beyond their and the vehicles capabilities. People not understanding the environmental conditions.
There are many accidents and incidences caused by ill informed, poorly prepared and low skilled travellers, these people rely on the goodwill of the experienced and prepared travellers to help them out when things turn pear shape.

The Gibb River Road will be fully bitumised within 5 years, the jump ups have been tar for about 10 years!

At some stage the only way to see and stay at many places will sadly be with commercial operators who will get priority, and restrictions on private individuals will increase through an expensive and limited permit system. I experience this already with bushwalking on iconic walks that are now "famous tourist walks" both overseas and in Australia.

I am glad I made the most of my youth and explored Australia in the early 1980's.
Not many people can say they have experienced our natural wonders independently and without crowds.

OJ.

100% agree Jack. I am so happy that I have seen most of remote Australia that 99% will never see. There is already talk that the Cape York road will be all bitumen within 5 years...so be it...the remote towns and communities up there also have a right to decent roads for freight and travel. Things are going to get a lot worse now with the huge uptake of new caravans and campers being sold and international travel likely to be on hold for a year or longer.



Wouldnt mind some of the money back that I have "wasted" on cars, motorbikes, hobbies, boats, drinks, etc.etc.....however..I had the time of my life and wouldn,t change a thing!!.


My idea of wasting money is say buying a $800 set of driving lights when I can get a set for $150 that do exactly the same thing......then again why didnt I buy a second hand 4wd for $15000 that will do exactly the same thing as my $50000 Pajero?


Its bloody lucky we are all different or else it would be a boring old world!

[jaffles]

Yeh its been interesting to observe over ones life.
The fly in and hire makes more jobs, tax, and money to go round. Same with giving tour operators greater access or the bigger bite. Independent travellers do spend but generally they are a scabby lot. Anyone who deals with nomads will tell you that, and touring 4x4 won't be far behind. However its uultimately why dirt roads get bitumened, to increase safe passage in all weather conditions for local commerce including tourism.

Its also about controlling the hordes as plenty of cool places have been closed due to those before abusing the privilege. That goes for general rubbish, human feaces, track abuse, dune abuse, choosing new camp sites in virgin flora, cutting down trees, a new fire place required for everyone, shooting up amenities, wild life, or live stock, the list goes on.

Not saying its fair or right but it all revolves around revenue and litigation, and authorities have a huge job controlling the free settles against costs of keeping it going.

If we want the good old days then its hard to pick and choose. I sure don't want another HJ47 trophy to go where few are, but I'm happy to pay. Be easier if everyone followed the rules and respected what they have a bit more though.


Now back to the tires, be patient, some OE will come up. But go the 17". Check out E-go.com.au for freight. Maybe try FB market to swap you 18's.

[landau351]

Not sure if this will help but ive just put 265/70 18s on my nx the rolling diameter is 830. with the 2" lift they fit fin with no scraping on full turn with the standard rims. nice big side wall for the beach as we have a big camper as well. gives me heaps of ground clearance as well as loads of space for articulation. the tyres are maxxi 771's, ive had them before on pajeros and have always gotten
well over 100K on a set, fantastic on the beach great on the highway and sensational in the wet. total cost was somewhere round the 1500 mark

[old Jack]

Not sure if this will help but ive just put 265/70 18s on my nx the rolling diameter is 830. with the 2" lift they fit fin with no scraping on full turn with the standard rims. nice big side wall for the beach as we have a big camper as well. gives me heaps of ground clearance as well as loads of space for articulation. the tyres are maxxi 771's, ive had them before on pajeros and have always gotten
well over 100K on a set, fantastic on the beach great on the highway and sensational in the wet. total cost was somewhere round the 1500 mark

At 830mm in diameter these tyres are 3mm over the legal limit but you would be unlucky to get pinged for this at a RWC inspection. Having a suspension lift does not increase the tyre clearance during the suspension articulation and I would expect the tyres to contact the body at full suspension compression with 3/4 to full steering lock. Have you tested this?
There would be no way snow chains could be used on the front wheels with 830mm diameter tyres.

I would be more worried about the effect it is having on the auto transmission with the TC being unlocked more often especially when towing. Auto-Mate will fix this but a 830mm diameter tyre is a big tyre for a Pajero to drive particularly off road and towing.

OJ.

[landau351]

yes i have tested it Old jack, many times and the lift does indeed help as the base line of the chassis isnt a flat plane (front of the wheel is inclined compared to behind the wheel) so therefore as its an inclined line and the wheel is circular it doesnt take much lift to increase the available space for the wheel to travel. The higher up the wheel you go the less distance from the centreline is required for the wheel to travel in an arc for example at the centre line the overall distance from one side to the other is 830mm at 50mm above the centre line the over distance front to back of the wheel is 745mm (figures only for illustration). The same almost goes for the rear of the wheel although there is a reasonable amount of free space. obviously at full compression of suspension this would change, however i dont see a situation where my springs are compressed that much that the wheel will be that far up in the guard without adding another 500kg to the front end

As for snow chains...mate im in queensland, if you have some spare snow by all means send it my way!!

As for the TC yes you are absolutely correct...automate is the next purchase on the long list of wishes along with some other goodies developed for the pajeros