Outlander Suspension Lift

[robdavo]

Just looking for some info re lifting the suspension a bit on a 2014 Outlander that my daughter has. (I have a Challenger myself with polyairs on the rear for towing).
Wondering if it possible to get a moderate front lift by adjusting existing suspension without the need to replace springs and shocks.
Also, assume that the simplest and cheapest for the rear is polyairs or similar.

They tow an on road camper trailer and really mostly on bitumen and some gravel, so don't need the full bells and whistles lift. Also roof racks with a kayak and a couple of bikes, and a 45L fridge in the back also adds to the overall drop in clearance in general.

Any suggestions appreciated.
Rob

[old Jack]

What year of manufacture?

cheers, OJ.

[robdavo]

Hi OJ
They bought it last year and I think it was the latest MY15 model.
Being a bit slack in not looking up the type of suspension myself, but I think it is different to the Challenger MY14.
Rob

[old Jack]

No Adjustment to stock suspension.

Something I have been researching for son-in-law who has similar issue.

http://www2.pajeroclub.com.au/forum/showthread.php?t=43499

I will dig up my data and post on what I have found so far.

cheers, old Jack.

[erad]

My wife's Outlander (MY13, first registered in January 2013) had good ground clearance when we frst got it. I could crawl under it with little trouble. Now, there is absolutely no way I could do that. OK - I have put on some weight LOL but I reckon the springs have sagged at least 40 mm in that time. And no - we haven't loaded that car up at all - different case with the Pajero.

Why is is that car springs sag? They should not be anywhere near their elastic limits, but most Japanese cars seem to sag after a relatively short time.

[robdavo]

No Adjustment to stock suspension.

Something I have been researching for son-in-law who has similar issue.

http://www2.pajeroclub.com.au/forum/showthread.php?t=43499

I will dig up my data and post on what I have found so far.

cheers, old Jack.

Ah haha. ..noticed from your link that rears are coil over shocks, so no polyairs option.
Will monitor these threads to see if a solution pops up, but looks like new springs and/or shocks is the only way.
Rob.

[MatthewP]

The front suspension on the outlander are macpherson struts.

The easiest way to get a little bit of lift is to fit strut spacers between the top of the strut and the body of the car.

This will increase the ride height by slightly more than the length of the spacer because of the position of the strut in relation to the hub and where the lower suspension arm bolts to the car.

Like any independent suspension, you cant raise it too much before you have to start worrying about CVs.

A 40mm or 45mm strut spacer should give around 50mm of lift and should still be safe for your CVs at full droop.

Since the strut spacer is basically just raising your car above the top of the strut, your suspension travel and where your car sits at rest in relation to that travel, remain unchanged.

Nissan Pathfinders used Macpherson strut front suspension, so if you have a look on their forums everything you need to know will be explained.
Some of them with bigger lifts have subframe spacers that lower the diff to help with cv angles.

The Pajero iO is another 4wd that has macpherson strut front suspension.

Strut spacers will change your camber angle slightly.
How much depends on what angle the strut bolts up into the car.

Smaller strut spacers shouldn't change it too much at all.

There are camber adjusters thst bolt to the top of the strut that can help fix this.

There are some camber adjusters that are strut spacers as well.

I have seen some strut spacers advertised that have a slight angle on them to counteract any camber change.

Most of the info on out there about macpherson struts is for lowering them not raising them, because of its far more commonly used in cars than 4wds.


And Old Jack the use of tennis balls inside the springs , in the link above, is absolute gold.
Please try and get some photos to go with any other info you dig up.
Absolutely Brilliant.

What diameter are the rear springs I dont have a tennis ball near me to check the size but you may be able to fit a coil over spring up inside the stock spring to help take the weight.
I think you can get coil over springs at 2.5inch diameter.

Edit.
I just googled tennis ball size and the official tennis ball has to be between 2.57 and 2.7 inches.


Matt

[old Jack]

These may be a solution, I emailed them several weeks ago and did not get a reply.

http://www.prothanesuspensionparts.com/proddetail.asp?prod=191705

Still the coil overs need to be removed and disassembled, parts fitted, reassembled and refitted so unless you can do this yourself it will cost $150 to $200 a corner in labour plus parts. Not sure what preassembled coilers are available as I was researching 2011/12 Outlanders.

RVCS Suspension Specification link;

http://rvcs-prodweb.dot.gov.au/perl/44625_1106715R_RVD_03Dec2014103223.cmd

Suspension Data

Vertical measurement wheel centre to top of wheel arch opening at unladen mass. Front 430mm Rear 437mm
Vertical measurement wheel centre to top of wheel arch opening at full bump. Front 330mm Rear 317mm
Minimum acceptable vertical measurement wheel centre to top of wheel arch. Front 397mm Rear 397mm


cheers, old Jack.

[Fritterbug]

Given the weight they are carrying and roads they drive on I would suggest they don't need a suspension lift but just need to increase the spring rate of the standard height suspension.

I don't know how that is done on an Outlander. Never looked at one.

This is what you are doing in your Challenger with Polyair bags. These bags don't give suspension lift. They reduce sag.

[robdavo]

Just received an email back from Polyair confirming that they don't have anything for either the front or rear for an Outlander with coil over shocks.
Their website shows polyairs for 2006 onwards, but this is obviously incorrect. They also advise that the coil over units for the Triton will not suit the Outlander.
Looks like it will require a heavier / progressive spring if, and when, these are available.

[MatthewP]

I googled the Prothane coil spring inserts that Old Jack mentioned in an above post.

They wont work with coil over suspension.

They are basically just big progressive rate bump stops that you can put inside your coil spring.

The reviews on them sound like they are brilliant for what they are.

The outside diameter of the insert is 3.75 inches and they are available in different lengths.
One of the jeep forums I read about them on said to just buy the longest ones and cut them down to fit.

If they are too stiff, holes can be drilled through the side of them to allow them to compress more easily.

Matt

[old Jack]

I was thinking since they have a centre hole through them, would it be possible to slide them over the strut shaft, just an idea out of left field.

Other alternative that might work is Sumo Coil Spring Helpers, again I have not looked at the viability.

For me a spring change is the best solution but it appears no one has any listing for the latest G Series Outlander.

cheers, old Jack.

[MatthewP]

Another option for a lift for the macpherson strut is to replace it with a longer strut.
The macpherson struts that most cars use these days aren't serviceable and the strut body is replaced with the shock as they are one piece.

the picture below I got off another forum and is a replacement strut for the 03 to 06 outlander.
KYB part no. 334368

If someone is willing to take some measurements of their strut and what model it is from, then we will have info to reference from, when looking for longer replacement struts.

Most of the measurements can be take with the strut still in the car.
The best measurements to compare against other struts are the extended length, the spacing between the bottom bolt holes, and the distance from the bottom of the strut to the spring pan.

A strut with a higher spring pan will give lift compared to the stock strut, with the same springs, as long as the shock has a similar length travel.


The length of the strut, as measured by the manufacturers, is from the centre of the bottom mount hole to the shoulder at the top of the shock, at the bottom of the thread.

The photo attached was not measured this way but we can still use it as a reference.

Matt

[MatthewP]

An easy way to get a little bit of lift is to install rubber coil spacers.
They can go on either the top or the bottom of the coil, or both if you need to.

A couple of links below,

http://m.summitracing.com/parts/mrg-1285/none/images

http://m.ebay.com.au/itm/380384438188?nav=SEARCH

They are easy to install.
You jack up the car under the body so the suspension can extend.
As soon as there is enough room to get in there, use spring compressors to clamp the springs and stop them from extending.

Keep jacking up the body of the car or until the suspension has drooped enough that the coil spacer can be inserted.

Yhe spring may need to be compressed further to allow room for the Inserts.

Then slowly lower the car, making sure to line up the springs.
And release the spring compressors slowly making sure it all lines up right.


They wont help with load carrying at all but may give a little bit of lift if that's all you're after.

Matt

[Dt1million]

40mm spacers and Kings 30 & 35mm lift springs have given me the ground clearance (loaded) that i was looking for.