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Bilsteins 50mm lift front end clunk on downtravel

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  • Maccaman194
    Member
    • Feb 2009
    • 99
    • Maitland NSW

    Bilsteins 50mm lift front end clunk on downtravel

    I fitted 50mm lift Lovells and Bilsteins to my NX Pajero. I now have a very heavy clunk sound every time the suspension drops when I am off road on uneven ground. Was like it right from the start as soon as these were fitted. Not on the factory setup. I checked all the torques with torque wrench and made sure it is all to spec (with the weight on the wheels). Not loose on the top mount plate either.
    There is no contact with the drive shaft by the upper or lower control arms.
    If I was guessing I would say that the shocks are too short and bottom out when the suspension drops eg when going over a hole in the track , and it does not need much down travel to do that either.
    Has anyone else had this problem?
    Can someone tell me what the length of the front strut should be so I can verify that I was supplied the correct one in the pre-assembled strut kit I purchased? Or a part number? Maybe the standard strut has been fitted to the raised spring?
    Any help appreciated
    thanks
    2017 NX Pajero. Lovells Bilsteins, other stuff
  • kblof
    Member
    • Apr 2017
    • 82
    • Radelaide

    #2
    Pretty sure the Billies only come in one length to suit both standard and raised lifts.
    I've played heaps with my set up and found that clunks like that can come from your sway bar mounts, shock mounts or maybe the rubber at the top or bottom of strut assembly wasn't up to it?
    The other place maybe where the 3 bolts attach to the body at the top of the strut which are a pain to get to under your starter battery and under the air box.
    Check your battery and air box are secured back properly?
    Hopefully you can determine which side it's coming from to help narrow your search?
    Good luck lets us know how you go?
    2011 NT Pajero| DID

    Comment

    • kblof
      Member
      • Apr 2017
      • 82
      • Radelaide

      #3
      here is the thread with lengths for you.
      2011 NT Pajero| DID

      Comment

      • honkur
        Junior Member
        • Apr 2019
        • 12
        • sunshine coast

        #4
        The clunk could be coming from the control arms hitting the shocks while they are at full travel, any lift kit fitted will most likely do this.
        To fix it you will have to get longer ball joints to allow travel. You can pick them up pretty cheap and are easy to change. have a look at online auto parts and look for extended ball joints... should help the problem.

        Comment

        • geopaj
          Valued Member
          • Jul 2007
          • 2749
          • Adelaide

          #5
          Originally posted by honkur View Post
          The clunk could be coming from the control arms hitting the shocks while they are at full travel, any lift kit fitted will most likely do this.
          To fix it you will have to get longer ball joints to allow travel. You can pick them up pretty cheap and are easy to change. have a look at online auto parts and look for extended ball joints... should help the problem.
          Wow- I’ve been around Pajeros for years and didn’t know this. Mine does exactly this - looks like I’ve got a new job to add to the list! Thanks!

          Are there any particular brands/suppliers that have better quality ones? (I couldn’t find a current listing for Gen 4s at Online Auto Parts )
          Silver NT VRX Di-D

          ARB bullbar | snorkel | Bushskinz & Boo’s guards | UltraGauge MX | 2" lift | Cooper AT3 LT's | dual battery | Superwinch X9 | 80ltr diesel tank | 22ltr water tank | aux trans cooler | MM Lockup Mate | GME UHF | locker/TC mod | SPV EGR | rear LED work light | rhino platform | ARB awning | rear drawers ... & plenty of scratches

          My Build Thread - HERE

          Previously - NL Pajero (now owned by Forum member 'Gemster')

          Comment

          • shawty950
            Member
            • Jun 2011
            • 218
            • Brisbane

            #6
            Check this as well

            I installed Bilstiens and Lovells EHD front springs to both my NT and BIL's NW.

            On the Bilsteins, there is a grooved ring and circlip for 2 different locations on the shock body to set the lower spring perch height.

            On mine, I set it at the highest position, BIL's I forgot to change it from as supplied in the lowest position.

            Mine had the symptoms you describe, clunk/metal scrape sound on extension/rebound on fast corrugations/sand whoops....BIL's on same track at same speed did not.

            I put it down to the extra preload and extending the shock/lower control arm (where the pink arrows points to...but on the underside ) into contacting the lower bump stop/over extending bolt on the sub-frame...(the orange arrows).



            IIRC, there really is no upper bump stop...(it's been 3 years since I had my Paj..so may have forgotten and cant tell from the manual)
            Attached Files
            SOLD at 150k's - 2011 NT Platinum Diesel auto. Wheels and tyres, cav filter, caddy storage/ausguard barrier and icom IC-440N. NoLimit Tuning Chip. T13 Bullbar. Other stuff when money allows.

            NOW - 2016 MQ Triton Exceed - All the TJM fruit re barwork, MCA Gold shocks and Parabolic rear leafs, TJM canopy, twin diff locks OEM rear and Harrop front, breathers, rhinorack, eco foxwing

            Comment

            • Maccaman194
              Member
              • Feb 2009
              • 99
              • Maitland NSW

              #7
              Bilsteins knock

              Thanks everyone for your replies. I will check it at the weekend again and see what I can find. Much appreciated
              2017 NX Pajero. Lovells Bilsteins, other stuff

              Comment

              • Maccaman194
                Member
                • Feb 2009
                • 99
                • Maitland NSW

                #8
                Bilsteins knock

                Originally posted by shawty950 View Post
                I installed Bilstiens and Lovells EHD front springs to both my NT and BIL's NW.

                On the Bilsteins, there is a grooved ring and circlip for 2 different locations on the shock body to set the lower spring perch height.

                On mine, I set it at the highest position, BIL's I forgot to change it from as supplied in the lowest position.

                Mine had the symptoms you describe, clunk/metal scrape sound on extension/rebound on fast corrugations/sand whoops....BIL's on same track at same speed did not.

                I put it down to the extra preload and extending the shock/lower control arm (where the pink arrows points to...but on the underside ) into contacting the lower bump stop/over extending bolt on the sub-frame...(the orange arrows).



                IIRC, there really is no upper bump stop...(it's been 3 years since I had my Paj..so may have forgotten and cant tell from the manual)
                Hi - I was not aware of that as the struts were supplied ready to fit. Is the higher position to allow for shorter(standard ride height) springs and the lower position for longer 50mm raised height springs? Or something else? What position should the lower spring perch sit on for 50mm lift spring/strut assembly? Vehicle is sitting at the correct extra 50mm height as is.
                2017 NX Pajero. Lovells Bilsteins, other stuff

                Comment

                • old Jack
                  Regular
                  • Jun 2011
                  • 11499
                  • Adelaide, South Australia.

                  #9
                  The Gen 4 front suspension does not have a fixed droop stop, only a compression bumpstop. This means the extended strut length will limit downward suspension travel (droop), however if the strut is too long then the strut body will contact the upper control arm and be the limiting factor for drop travel.

                  Care needs to be taken to have the strut compressed length shorter than the suspension travel with the compression bumpstop fully compressed, otherwise the strut will bottom out and the strut shaft will bend. The diameter of the strut body also influences how much suspension droop occurs before the strut body hits the upper control arm.

                  In regards to the position of the circlip on the Bilstein strut, I seem to recall when working on Pajero 12's NW that the circlip is in the lower groove on the strut body. When the suspension is fully compressed and bottomed out on the compressed compression bumpstop, then the coil shoul still have gaps between the coil winds so the coil is not compressing 100%.

                  OJ.
                  2011 PB Base White Auto, Smartbar, Cooper STMaxx LT235/85R-16,TPMS, HR TB, 3 x Bushskinz, front +40mm Dobinson , rear +50mm EHDVR Lovells, Dobinson MT struts and shockers, Peddars 5899 cone springs, Windcheater rack, GME UHF, Custom alloy drawer system inc. 30lt Engel & 2 x 30 AH LiFePo batteries + elec controls, Tailgate hi-lift/long struts, Phillips +100 LB & HB, Lightforce 20" single row driving beam LED lightbar, Scanguage II.
                  MM4x4 Auto Mate, Serial No 1 .

                  Comment

                  • Maccaman194
                    Member
                    • Feb 2009
                    • 99
                    • Maitland NSW

                    #10
                    Bilsteins knock

                    Hi Old Jack. Thanks for that info. I checked - I can see a groove in the strut body about 10mm or so below the spring platform, so I would say the supplier has fitted it incorrectly in the top groove position when assembling the strut kit. I have asked them (4WD Direct) what is the correct position. I will have to remove and disassemble the strut and spring to change the circlip position if it is incorrect. And given I will not attempt to compress heavy springs like that looks like I will be paying up for a workshop to do it.
                    If others could please check what groove their 50mm lift strut sits in and let me know would be great
                    thanks
                    2017 NX Pajero. Lovells Bilsteins, other stuff

                    Comment

                    • old Jack
                      Regular
                      • Jun 2011
                      • 11499
                      • Adelaide, South Australia.

                      #11
                      Hi Macca,

                      What is your front ride height, measured from centre of hub to underside of wheel arch?
                      I will also ask Pajero 12 to have a look at his front struts. It has been a few years since we did his suspension so I am just going by memory. He has not complained about a clunking noise at full suspension droop and I have not noticed it when I have driven his car off road. He has King coils and Bilstein struts.

                      OJ.
                      2011 PB Base White Auto, Smartbar, Cooper STMaxx LT235/85R-16,TPMS, HR TB, 3 x Bushskinz, front +40mm Dobinson , rear +50mm EHDVR Lovells, Dobinson MT struts and shockers, Peddars 5899 cone springs, Windcheater rack, GME UHF, Custom alloy drawer system inc. 30lt Engel & 2 x 30 AH LiFePo batteries + elec controls, Tailgate hi-lift/long struts, Phillips +100 LB & HB, Lightforce 20" single row driving beam LED lightbar, Scanguage II.
                      MM4x4 Auto Mate, Serial No 1 .

                      Comment

                      • honkur
                        Junior Member
                        • Apr 2019
                        • 12
                        • sunshine coast

                        #12
                        Not sure about gen 4 but i couldn't imagine they would be much different, to be honest. try this link https://www.onlineautoparts.com.au/p...xoClmIQAvD_BwE but you could always ask them and if they don't match just send them back they are pretty good to deal with. as for certain brand yet to try more than 1 to be honest so have nothing on that sorry.

                        Comment

                        • Maccaman194
                          Member
                          • Feb 2009
                          • 99
                          • Maitland NSW

                          #13
                          Bilsteins knock

                          Originally posted by old Jack View Post
                          Hi Macca,

                          What is your front ride height, measured from centre of hub to underside of wheel arch?
                          I will also ask Pajero 12 to have a look at his front struts. It has been a few years since we did his suspension so I am just going by memory. He has not complained about a clunking noise at full suspension droop and I have not noticed it when I have driven his car off road. He has King coils and Bilstein struts.

                          OJ.


                          Hi OJ
                          That would be much appreciated. Front Drivers front 545mm, Passenger 555mm. Rear is 560 Drivers side, Passenger 545. Pretty level really. I got a call from the supplier at 4WD Direct. Very honest and helpful. Looks like they would normally fit the spring platform on the bottom groove and circlip position, whereas mine has been positioned on the top position. They only use the top position if a heavy bullbar and or winch is fitted. I still don't really see why that will make a big clunk noise as the suspension drops to the bottom, but the supplier is sure it is not right and they have never heard any feedback till now about this noise. So he assumes that is the problem and will repair at their cost.
                          Any other ideas on why that might cause this noise? I just looked again, there is no evidence of anything hitting the strut or the upper control arm or the drive shaft. I also can't see how the sway bar could cause it, but I might disconnect that and see if it makes any difference.
                          2017 NX Pajero. Lovells Bilsteins, other stuff

                          Comment

                          • old Jack
                            Regular
                            • Jun 2011
                            • 11499
                            • Adelaide, South Australia.

                            #14
                            Originally posted by Maccaman194 View Post
                            Hi OJ
                            That would be much appreciated. Front Drivers front 545mm, Passenger 555mm. Rear is 560 Drivers side, Passenger 545. Pretty level really. I got a call from the supplier at 4WD Direct. Very honest and helpful. Looks like they would normally fit the spring platform on the bottom groove and circlip position, whereas mine has been positioned on the top position. They only use the top position if a heavy bullbar and or winch is fitted. I still don't really see why that will make a big clunk noise as the suspension drops to the bottom, but the supplier is sure it is not right and they have never heard any feedback till now about this noise. So he assumes that is the problem and will repair at their cost.
                            Any other ideas on why that might cause this noise? I just looked again, there is no evidence of anything hitting the strut or the upper control arm or the drive shaft. I also can't see how the sway bar could cause it, but I might disconnect that and see if it makes any difference.

                            Hi Macca,

                            Your front ride height of 545-555mm is slightly on the high side but not excessively high.

                            Do you know what part number coils are fitted?
                            Are the coils fitted the correct coils as per your order?
                            Do not laugh I have had several assembled front struts from different suppliers where they have use an incorrect part number spring to what I had ordered.


                            OJ.
                            2011 PB Base White Auto, Smartbar, Cooper STMaxx LT235/85R-16,TPMS, HR TB, 3 x Bushskinz, front +40mm Dobinson , rear +50mm EHDVR Lovells, Dobinson MT struts and shockers, Peddars 5899 cone springs, Windcheater rack, GME UHF, Custom alloy drawer system inc. 30lt Engel & 2 x 30 AH LiFePo batteries + elec controls, Tailgate hi-lift/long struts, Phillips +100 LB & HB, Lightforce 20" single row driving beam LED lightbar, Scanguage II.
                            MM4x4 Auto Mate, Serial No 1 .

                            Comment

                            • Maccaman194
                              Member
                              • Feb 2009
                              • 99
                              • Maitland NSW

                              #15
                              Bilsteins knock

                              Originally posted by shawty950 View Post
                              I installed Bilstiens and Lovells EHD front springs to both my NT and BIL's NW.

                              On the Bilsteins, there is a grooved ring and circlip for 2 different locations on the shock body to set the lower spring perch height.

                              On mine, I set it at the highest position, BIL's I forgot to change it from as supplied in the lowest position.

                              Mine had the symptoms you describe, clunk/metal scrape sound on extension/rebound on fast corrugations/sand whoops....BIL's on same track at same speed did not.

                              I put it down to the extra preload and extending the shock/lower control arm (where the pink arrows points to...but on the underside ) into contacting the lower bump stop/over extending bolt on the sub-frame...(the orange arrows).



                              IIRC, there really is no upper bump stop...(it's been 3 years since I had my Paj..so may have forgotten and cant tell from the manual)

                              Hi
                              well I think you are correct. I was in the process of pulling the struts out to send back to 4WD Direct, because they told me the circlip should definitely be in the bottom groove and mine is the top groove. But then I noticed that with the suspension at full droop, the lower control arm strikes the cross member structure (near the rearward bush) exactly where the red/orange arrows on your drawing show. I ground some of the offending support away (3mm or so) so there is clearance. It was only on the drivers side. If the camber adjustment bolts are adjusted so the control arm is out further towards the wheel, there is no contact. I cannot see how the higher preload with the circlip position makes any difference. But I will see how it goes now - I took it for a run over some gutters etc - no clunk now, but no bouncy terrain local so I'll have to test it tomorrow.
                              Attached Files
                              2017 NX Pajero. Lovells Bilsteins, other stuff

                              Comment

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