Thinking of a change

[Tony G]

Hi all
I currently have a 2012 PB Challenger which will possibly be changed over later in the year.
I am keen on a new Pajero and have a couple of questions.
DPF is now fitted, how does the burn cycle work, read somewhere DPF's are expensive if something goes wrong, as part of the exhaust system are they covered by warranty.
We have a van which is maximum 2100kg, how do the Pajero's tow, do they have problems with the auto locking up like the auto PB challengers do, I realise driving techniques play a part in this issue.
GLX or GLS are the extra features worth the difference in price.
Any other comments would be welcome.

Thanks

[BruceandBobbi]

No matter what brand you buy if it's a diesel it will have a DPF. Toyota are having trouble with their DPF system.

Totally different gearbox in the Pajero after the NS. The NS and Challenger have a Jatco box but programmed differently. From NT on the Pajeros had an Aisin.

As for different features only you can say are they needed to your requirements. Me I prefer less to go wrong so fairly basic for us.

[KiwiNTPajero]

i suggest you go for a drive in a Pajero.Quite a different drive than a challenger.The 3.2 and the aisin g box make the major difference.

[Stevenf]

Regarding torque converter lockp when towing.

U have to drive in manual mode and keep changing down to keep torque converter locked up.

I cannot use 5 when towing my 2000kg van unless going down hill.

Have to drive in 4th. ~ 2800 at 100km.

Have to change to 3rd under 80km when pushing hard up hills to keep torque converter locked.

Took a while to get use to 2800 rpm but now use to it and pajero happy to do it all day...

The pajero auto simply cannot stay locked up at 2000 rpm as the huge 3.2l 4 cylinder creates too much vibration for the automatic transmission.

Do all autos have this problem?

[cannonsjs]

I've just made this same switch. I tow a ~1500kg camper and had a manual PC Challenger and just bought a NX Pajero.

For a tow vehicle I don't think there is a lot in it. Once up and running the Challenger pulls at least as strongly as the Pajero. While the Paj has an extra 41Nm I reckon most, if not all of it, is lost in the auto gearbox. The Challenger is more economical and a nicer drive once up and running. On the open road I'd just set the cruise control and it would be fine in 5th unless we came to a steep hill. As was mentioned above the Paj locks and unlocks the TC at the slightest rise if you do that. I also like the live rear axle in the Challenger for towing since the suspension geometry doesn't change when you hitch and unhitch the camper. For starting off at the lights and slow speed maneuvering the Paj wins hands down with the auto vs the high 1st gear in the Challenger. I'd still be driving the Challenger and have extra money in my pocket if it wasn't for the fact I'm not convinced the engines are a good thing long term.

For a daily driver the Pajero wins hands down. Pretty much everything about it is nicer than the Challenger, but the price difference reflects that.

[Tony G]

Thanks for the comments guys.
Cannonsjs my PB is also a manual and yes the high first gear is a pain in the butt sometimes, I am happy how it tows but the seats aren't the best when touring. I am now out of warranty and have had the motor replaced due to the cooling system failure, so the thoughts of reliability are always in the back of my mind.

[Merts]

It may be worth your while to consider the Paj Sport too?

Similar size and concept to the Challenger, but improved in pretty much every area.

[fester]

We went from an auto Challenger to the Pajero. The Challenger was a bucket of shite and towed hopelessly. Handled our 2t van well enough but it was a tiring and frustrating experience. Hated it from early on and put up with it for as long as possible but in the end I dreaded getting in it. Ours was not a lemon or anything I just felt they were a crap car. Manual of course made a huge difference but I won't have a manual 4WD. The Pajero auto is light years ahead of the Challenger auto. There is the PS but I hate the styling, hate the way smaller diesels put their power down and I have no faith in the 8 speed auto.

Ideally for towing I'd be in a Dodge Ram but in our current budget the Pajero is just right.

[DID Dash]

Good luck with your decision. I also have a Challenger with manual trans and been very happy with it. I only tow up to around 1500kg and apart from getting off the line, it tows my camper effortlessly. I went out looking for a replacement for it about a year ago thinking to offload it while within capped price service and warranty period. I was disappointed to find that neither Pajero NX or Pajero Sport was available with manual trans. so after a brief test drive of both in auto, came home with the Challenger. I am going to keep it for a bit longer as I still enjoy it and so far it has been comfortable and reliable. My only experience with an automatic Pajero was my NS 'R' shorty (auto only) which I recall towed the same camper less convincingly due to detectable torque convertor slippage. The NS had the old Jatco box, I have no experience with the Asian box in the NT-NX, but many favor it. I am now thinking to purchase an NX Pajero shortly before it is discontinued / replaced, whenever that may be.

[Merts]

My only experience with an automatic Pajero was my NS 'R' shorty (auto only) which I recall towed the same camper less convincingly due to detectable torque convertor slippage. The NS had the old Jatco box, I have no experience with the Asian box in the NT-NX, but many favor it. I am now thinking to purchase an NX Pajero shortly before it is discontinued / replaced, whenever that may be.

I also had an NS, and now have an MQ Triton which has the same Aisin 5 speed as the newer Pajeros. I can confirm that the Aisin box is a much better beast for towing, and for everything really. Like all autos, it doesn't stay locked all the time, but there is much less unlocking than I experienced with the NS.

[Mundy55]

I tow a 1250kg camper van and, like others, find with any sort of even minor head wind or uphill grade, it won't stay in 5th locked. After much trialling, I haven't found any appreciable saving in fuel in driving in 4th/5th manual or auto. For me the issue is heat and stress on the transmission.

On the last trip over the past week, due to the high ambient temps I drove in manual 4th/5th. When it dropped out of 5th locked on any more than a minor hill I dropped down into 4th. I found it stayed locked in 4th on virtually any but the steepest of highway hills. I also find travelling at 110kph gauge (which is 104kph real) the TC stayed locked the most. Faster meant higher wind resistance, lower meant torque available (I assume) was not quite enough to keep it locked.

Coming back to Sydney from the south yesterday there was a quite strong tailwind which meant mine stayed locked in 5th on even minor hills.

Overall, I am really happy with the towing of my NX, the only issue being the 500km range with the standard fuel tank when I tow.

[dave0l]

The best option is to hunt around for a low kms manual, or convert one.

The Pajero is awesome with one major flaw...

I have a 2015 NX auto and my parents have a 2012 with a manual

The version they have is an ex fleet vehicle so it only has 5 seats and the front aircon only.
However the manual feels much much lighter, accelerate better, way, way better at towing

The manual feels like the car has lost 250 KG and added 40-50 KW

I wonder if any 6 speed manuals from another car can be made to work ?

The A750 can produce vibration at certain speed once the fluid gets older, also the gearing and the engine combines in a way that so it doesn't particularly like being under 2000 RPM, because of vibration and harshness ... it is just a bad combination

Also a 6 speed auto with more appropriate ratios, and a torque converter that locks 98% of the time like the modern Mazda's would be a huge, massive leap forward.

Its obvious that the auto gearbox needs another ratio, but MM programmed the TC to slip in 5th because 4th is a little low but 5th a little high under moderate load uphill with a trailer. A 6 speed will bring the ratios closer together and fix this instantly

Or just put all auto boxes where they belong ... the recycle plant.. melted down to make a manual !