Towing

[BOGWHEEL]

Towing van with 175kg ball weight with new GLS. (no front bar - rear seats removed)

When hitched, both front and rear go up and down 20mm. Doesn't seem much, but more concerned about ride when on the move.

Have off road hitch and hate WDH. Have spoken to about six suspension mobs, and half say just air bags and the other say different coils. (MM also said no to air bags)

Your thoughts please.

[Ian H]

Hate then or not, you need a WDH. Airbags and springs help but do absolutely nothing to remove weight from the rear axles where the trouble begins. You need to go to a weigh bridge when loaded and full of fuel to find out exactly how much more you can add to the car. A moderately loaded Paj will be over or at least close to it, when you add another 175kg on the back.

Best you find out now rather than when you get pulled over for a weigh check.

[nj swb]

If you're serious about taking your van offroad then I don't believe a WDH is the right solution for you.

Different springs vs airbags is another issue, significantly affected by how you use your Paj. If it is normally loaded with stuff, even when the van isn't connected, then stronger springs would make a bit of sense. If you travel basically empty when you don't have the van on the back then stronger springs may lead to an uncomfortable ride, and air bags might be an appropriate solution - or part of an appropriate solution.

Do you drive your Pajero empty?

[spot01]

The MMAL website recommends a WDH:

https://www.mitsubishi-motors.com.au/towing

Their engineers would have done quite a bit of work testing this.


If you are towing in trying off road conditions, there may be a different approach.

[Hill]

The problem with ball weight is that you need to multiply it by around 1.5 to work out increased axle load and remove load rear seat had on rear axle load to work out increased axle load.

My tyre/suspension guy recommended keeping rear suspension of our Pajero within 20 mm of normal ride height when loaded . This provided even rear tyre wear.

We set up our NT series up with plus 200kg rear springs and air bags. Our Quantum had around 220kg ball weight. We carried a bit of gear in rear of car.

Front and rear lifted springs were lifted.

Work out what you are going to load into car and set car up to cope with load of van and car.

Hill

[2bad4u]

It depends on your individual setup. I started out with a WDH, then added airbags, then upgraded springs and removed airbags but still used a WDH. This was with a van that had a 230-240kg ball weight. I have just upgraded my van and the new one has only got 180kg on the ball and I simply don’t need a WDH anymore as the springs alone have kept everything nice and level. Plus the way I load and extras on the car (bull bar, etc) mean I don’t lose much weight off the front.

I’m not anti WDH and would promote their use when needed but without knowing your setup and how you load the vehicle no one can say you NEED one.

This may help you to understand......

https://www.caravancampingsales.com.au/editorial/details/are-load-levellers-a-waste-of-time-56620/

[Ian H]

I’m not anti WDH and would promote their use when needed but without knowing your setup and how you load the vehicle no one can say you NEED one.
/[/URL]

To say that with a ball weight of 180kg means you don't need a WDH is just wrong.

I've just had my Paj weighed and with full tanks of fuel and some normal gear in the car, including an alloy bar and no winch....I only had 145kg left before I hit GVM. So even a camper trailer with a ball weight of 150kg would put me over.

of course, as others have said, if going off road, you can't use a WDH but all the springs in the wortld and airbags as well don't change the numbers. They just make the car ride level.

[2bad4u]

To say that with a ball weight of 180kg means you don't need a WDH is just wrong

To say I need one is just wrong. You don’t know my setup or the OPs so you can’t just say a WDH is needed.

[Ian H]

I simply don’t need a WDH anymore as the springs alone have kept everything nice and level. /[/URL]

Mate, we'll just have to agree to disagree but that statement isn't the point. It's not about being level, it's all about being legal and there's a big difference.

[2bad4u]

I simply don’t need a WDH anymore as the springs alone have kept everything nice and level. Plus the way I load and extras on the car (bull bar, etc) mean I don’t lose much weight off the front.

You missed part of my quote. Fully understand legalities but apart from weight transfer, a WDH also affects the ride level. In my case (with just 2 links used) it did nothing for the front of the car but raised the rear of the car which also raised the nose of the van giving it a dangerous nose up attitude.

As stated, I’m not anti WDH but think it foolish to assume that one is always needed.

[Ian H]

We are probably off topic a bit but if it raised the nose of your van to what you call a dangerous nose up attitude, you don't have it set up correctly. Happy to start a thread to discuss further if you like.

[old Jack]

Towing van with 175kg ball weight with new GLS. (no front bar - rear seats removed)

When hitched, both front and rear go up and down 20mm. Doesn't seem much, but more concerned about ride when on the move.

Have off road hitch and hate WDH. Have spoken to about six suspension mobs, and half say just air bags and the other say different coils. (MM also said no to air bags)

Your thoughts please.

To have a 20mm increase in front ride height indicates that the real ball weight is more than 175kg.
Has the ball weight been measured when the van is fully loaded?
Many new caravans and even camper trailers have loaded ball loads in excess of 200kg so this puts 300kg on the rear axle!

Depending on the hitch used and how far out it extends, the leverage factor could be between 1.45 and 1.5 so for every 100kg of ball weight, about another 50kgs of weight will be transferred off the front axle and onto the rear axle.

A WDH correctly setup should only transfer the weight that was transferred off the front axle back to the front axle. Too many people try and use the WDH to compensate for soft rear coils, if you tow heavy you need stronger rear coils and in some cases you will also nee airbags to assist further. Trying to use airbags only is fraught with risk and this will eventually cause problems with airbag only setups. The rear factory coils are way too soft for all but the lightest loads in either the rear cargo area or towball loads.

This is what happens when you get the setup all wrong!

https://www.adelaidenow.com.au/news/south-australia/south-australian-couple-survive-caravan-rollover-caught-on-video/news-story/cd0161d09e04ffa23dc7758910b70890

OJ.

[nj swb]

Mate, we'll just have to agree to disagree but that statement isn't the point. It's not about being level, it's all about being legal and there's a big difference.

So Ian is concerned (quite rightly) about maintaining legal axle loads, which the OP hasn't flagged as being a concern.

If axle loads are within legal limits there are other ways to manage ride heights than a WDH.

If the OP is serious about towing his van in rugged offroad terrain then a WDH can increase stress on the towbar to the point of failures. Which may be why the OP doesn't want one.

If this is the case, the OP needs a suspension solution that can cope with the loads imposed by the van, and careful management of loads to ensure the vehicle axle weights are maintained within legal limits, and the van doesn't become a stability hazard in waiting - as per OJ's link.

[BOGWHEEL]

Thanks - ball weight was 174kg empty, but have since located the hitch to the bottom of the drawbar, which also shortened it by about 150mm. Set up to suit the Amarok which I know regret selling
have never needed a WDH on my last three vans, all towed by dual cabs with soft leaves brilliantly.

There is just the two of us, with mainly chairs and weber in the rear. Everything else is in the van

Will do the weighbridge thing again.
So I can get heavier coils that are still compfy when no van on back?

[jkwpajero]

I've just had my Paj weighed and with full tanks of fuel and some normal gear in the car, including an alloy bar and no winch....I only had 145kg left before I hit GVM. So even a camper trailer with a ball weight of 150kg would put me over.

That applies to YOUR vehicle with quite a bit of weight from the LRA tank, draws etc. My vehicle has pretty much bugger all in the rear compared to yours. Each case needs to be looked at individually. The OP is different so your vehicle is not an example comparable to his. The basic info of getting front/rear/ total weights at a weighbridge is where to start.


JamesW