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-   -   Door switch excessive current (https://www2.pajeroclub.com.au/forum/showthread.php?t=66283)

disco stu 16-01-20 12:51 PM

Door switch excessive current
 
So, on going to put the windows up on the car in preparation for the rain I found the battery down to 7v-obviously some parasitic current draw somewhere

I've figured out that there is something going on with the drivers door switch. On the other doors the current goes up 40ma when door opens-from 0.15a to 0.19a. On the drivers door on opening it goes right up to around 500ma on opening. Must have left the drivers door ajar for a few days.

The switch appears to be fine, although I pulled it apart to clean it up anyway (and lost the spring, which led to a 10min job turning into hours-it was stuck to the bottom of the inox can somehow). I'm guessing the issue is further up the wiring somewhere.

Anyone got any ideas where the issue here might be located?

Just doesn't seem to end with this car!

Would appreciate any hints if you have any

Cheers

Stu

Mulcher 26-01-20 01:44 PM

Apologies for the verbose nature of this response, this is just how my brain works.

Under normal circumstances, I'd expect the current draw to increase by about 500mA for interior light/s, when you open the door. Maybe as much as 1A if there are several. Actually, it's potentially more, given that there's a central, rear and a door light in a Pajero and each of them is probably 5W, or just under 500mA per globe, in a 12V system. Assuming they're all working properly.

Hope that makes sense.

How many wires are on the interior light switch? If just the one, then closing the switch, when the door opens, will provide an earth, completing the interior light circuit which provides a pathway for current to flow through the interior light globes, lighting them up.

With those current draw figures, the other doors don't sound like those door switches are working properly ie. the interior lights probably aren't working, through those door switches. Can you firstly verify that they are indeed working? I'm tipping they aren't.

I'm just working through how I'd diagnose where your battery drain might be located. From what you said, it does sound like the drivers door was left ajar and drained your battery. That would explain why it went flat. As for those current drain figures you'd mentioned, the drivers door sounds perfectly normal, taking into consideration how many interior lights actually work. I reckon there'd be one working, based on the 500mA draw you saw on your ammeter. BTW, did you have your ammeter between your battery post and the disconnected battery terminal? If not, that's the best place to start looking. Bear in mind of your turn on your ignition, you'll probably blow the fuse in your multimeter. Just a heads-up. Not assuming you don't know that, just making sure you do.

Other things that sometimes cause batteries to go flat are a glovebox light that doesn't go out ie. faulty switch. Loose fan belt, old battery, dodgy charge circuit wiring (less likely) or an alternator that isn't working properly.

Kick that around and see what you come back with.

Cheers

stumagoo 26-01-20 01:52 PM

Quote:

Originally Posted by Mulcher (Post 625175)
Apologies for the verbose nature of this response, this is just how my brain works.

Under normal circumstances, I'd expect the current draw to increase by about 500mA for interior light/s, when you open the door. Maybe as much as 1A if there are several. Actually, it's potentially more, given that there's a central, rear and a door light in a Pajero and each of them is probably 5W, or just under 500mA per globe, in a 12V system. Assuming they're all working properly.

Hope that makes sense.

How many wires are on the interior light switch? If just the one, then closing the switch, when the door opens, will provide an earth, completing the interior light circuit which provides a pathway for current to flow through the interior light globes, lighting them up.

With those current draw figures, the other doors don't sound like those door switches are working properly ie. the interior lights probably aren't working, through those door switches. Can you firstly verify that they are indeed working? I'm tipping they aren't.

I'm just working through how I'd diagnose where your battery drain might be located. From what you said, it does sound like the drivers door was left ajar and drained your battery. That would explain why it went flat. As for those current drain figures you'd mentioned, the drivers door sounds perfectly normal, taking into consideration how many interior lights actually work. I reckon there'd be one working, based on the 500mA draw you saw on your ammeter. BTW, did you have your ammeter between your battery post and the disconnected battery terminal? If not, that's the best place to start looking. Bear in mind of your turn on your ignition, you'll probably blow the fuse in your multimeter. Just a heads-up. Not assuming you don't know that, just making sure you do.

Other things that sometimes cause batteries to go flat are a glovebox light that doesn't go out ie. faulty switch. Loose fan belt, old battery, dodgy charge circuit wiring (less likely) or an alternator that isn't working properly.

Kick that around and see what you come back with.

Cheers

if he has an exceed he could have even more lights - I have lights in my door trims as well as the rear and middle roof light and most the globes are 5amp globes I think

Disco stu - I have heard that the plug at the top of the drivers A pillar for the cabin light is prone to getting dodgy - also there is the fact that there maybe a micro switch on the door latch mech that is triggered when the door is open (dont know for sure about that one) finally you need to look for wires that have rubbed through some of their insulatioin and may be shorting out on each other....

disco stu 26-01-20 02:24 PM

Thanks guys.

Yes, multimeter was between battery terminal and cable terminal, disconnected of course. Don't worry, not offended!

I got those current draw figures with the light switches all off, so it was purely signal not actual draw from the light bulbs themselves. That's the part that concerns me

I just double checked all the doors, and they are all turning the light on fine inside the cabin.

I'll check the glove box light. Didn't even know it had one!

Mine is the escape model, whatever that is in gls/gl etc etc. I've got the door trim lights, but I'm prey sure the door trim was off the door at that time. I'll double check that though as it could be the source, and would indicate the globe was just blown on the passenger door

Next best bet sounds like the insulation rubbed through, which I don't like the idea of trying to find as it appears that wiring runs through the sill

Thanks for the hints mulcher and Stu, given me some more things to check

Mulcher 26-01-20 02:38 PM

Quote:

Originally Posted by stumagoo (Post 625177)
if he has an exceed he could have even more lights - I have lights in my door trims as well as the rear and middle roof light and most the globes are 5amp globes I think

Disco stu - I have heard that the plug at the top of the drivers A pillar for the cabin light is prone to getting dodgy - also there is the fact that there maybe a micro switch on the door latch mech that is triggered when the door is open (dont know for sure about that one) finally you need to look for wires that have rubbed through some of their insulatioin and may be shorting out on each other....

Sure, more lights = a larger current draw. Each of the lights would be around a 5 watt globe. That's just under 500mA, or half an amp, at 12V, for each working globe. I'm just adding this information for clarity and accuracy. Saying a globe is a 5 amp globe could confuse the situation, if the user is checking their ammeter and expecting 5 amps current draw per globe. That'd be about right for headlight globes, not interior light globes.

The chances of wiring being a problem are low, in my opinion, due to the information presented by Disco Stu. Not ruling them out, but it might waste his time, chasing down a fault that, from the information presented, doesn't appear to exist. Unless you're talking about why the other doors don't seem to make the interior lights work. Again, this is based on the information presented by Disco Stu. In which case, great information to put out there, in an effort to help someone out.

disco stu 26-01-20 03:58 PM

Not sure if you saw my reply before yours Mulcher. All door light switches are working properly.

I just checked again with the bulbs pulled out of the door trims. 80ma with passenger door open, 200ma with drivers door open. I must have done it previously with the door trim lights installed and working

I still feel that 200ma is more than it should be, just for driving the little globe in the dash, but it's better than 500ma

Mulcher 30-01-20 08:48 AM

No I hadn't seen the reply and for some reason, I kept getting a database error whenever I tried to access this page over the past few days.

Interesting info on different current draw between the two front doors.

I recently bought a 2000 Escape and am in the process of getting it on the road. One of the things that needed fixing was the interior light switch in the front passengers door. What's really interesting about that is that I unlocked the doors with the remote, opened the front passenger door and chucked the keys on to the drivers seat, thinking that the auto re-lock had been disabled by me opening the passenger door. Imagine my surprise when, 30 seconds or so later, the doors auto re-locked. Looks as if the problem with that door not activating the interior light also didn't tell the central locking to deactivate. Luckily I'm yet to replace the solenoid for the rear tailgate central locking so got in that way.

So, I pulled the switch out of the passenger door and there were two wires coming out of it. Contacts were dirty, all good. Oddly enough, it still needed the earth through the mounting screw to activate the interior light. Therefore, the switches in the front (back door switches only had one wire), do more than just turn on/off the interior lights. That second wire looks like it's headed to the central locking system and who knows what else.

Personally, I would not be at all concerned with the difference in current draw between the two doors when they're open. There could be an extra circuit or more that are activated when you open the drivers door.

Bear in mind that you're looking for a cause of your flat battery and whilst I'm curious about the increased current draw when the drivers door is opened, that current draw increase isn't a factor when all of the doors are closed.

If the current leak isn't apparent when the vehicle is locked ie. when all of the electrical systems except the clock are deactivated, you don't have a leak.

If, as you first mentioned, the flat battery may have been caused by you leaving the drivers door ajar, that may have been the cause of the problem. Have you checked to make sure the charging system is OK? A loose fan belt could cause a flat battery too. How old's the battery? Four years was usually a reasonable life expectancy. I'd charge it up for a day or so if possible and get it load-tested to make sure it's actually OK.

Chances are you've done all that anyway, I'm tipping leaving the door ajar caused the problem but I wouldn't rule out you also having a weak battery.

P.S. They may not have a glovebox light, I mentioned that as they were sometimes the cause of a current leak. That and a boot light that didn't go out but that wouldn't apply to our vehicles :)

Martynhpajero 30-01-20 10:26 AM

Dry
Quote:

Originally Posted by disco stu (Post 624482)
So, on going to put the windows up on the car in preparation for the rain I found the battery down to 7v-obviously some parasitic current draw somewhere



I've figured out that there is something going on with the drivers door switch. On the other doors the current goes up 40ma when door opens-from 0.15a to 0.19a. On the drivers door on opening it goes right up to around 500ma on opening. Must have left the drivers door ajar for a few days.



The switch appears to be fine, although I pulled it apart to clean it up anyway (and lost the spring, which led to a 10min job turning into hours-it was stuck to the bottom of the inox can somehow). I'm guessing the issue is further up the wiring somewhere.



Anyone got any ideas where the issue here might be located?



Just doesn't seem to end with this car!



Would appreciate any hints if you have any



Cheers



Stu

Sent from my SM-J530Y using Tapatalk

disco stu 30-01-20 04:54 PM

Quote:

Originally Posted by Mulcher (Post 625215)
No I hadn't seen the reply and for some reason, I kept getting a database error whenever I tried to access this page over the past few days.

Interesting info on different current draw between the two front doors.

I recently bought a 2000 Escape and am in the process of getting it on the road. One of the things that needed fixing was the interior light switch in the front passengers door. What's really interesting about th..........
:)

Lucky you got back in with your issue. I gather it's an American thing having doors that lock themselves. I remember being there and most cars having that

I noticed that there were 2 wires with the drivers door switch and it needed earth as well. Was surprised by that

I think you're right with not worrying about it-just make sure the door isn't left open for long periods. Seems the easiest option! If current draw was really high I thought I should chase it, but at this I don't think it's worth the trouble, if it even is an issue, like you say

I got database error as well for the last few days

Cheers for your advice

Mulcher 31-01-20 08:04 AM

I've owned two Australian release Escapes now and both of them re-lock the doors if you unlock with the remote but don't open a door. It seems to be a standard feature on these, try it out.

No worries, happy to help where I can.


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